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Author: Subject: Flexifoil Sting Vs Flexifoil Rage (Static)
Mark_ja_drury




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[*] posted on 11-18-2018 at 09:29 AM
Flexifoil Sting Vs Flexifoil Rage (Static)


I am new to powerkiting but am already addicted to it and what you can do with a 4 line kite.

I have bought 2 Flexifoil Stings in 1.2 and 2.4 sizes and am long for a 1.7.

My question is how do the Flexifoil Rage in 1.8 and 2.5 compare to the Sting? I am tempted by them but am curious if and how they would compare to how the Sting flys?

I am currently flying staticly but might get a buggy at some point.




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abkayak


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[*] posted on 11-18-2018 at 09:47 AM


welcome:thumbup:
amazing how the addiction takes over right?...anyway glad your all in but imo,
save your $$$ you seem covered in small kites and will have a lot of overlap
get a 3m because your gonna be jonesing for that next or keep buying what compells you either one:D




US-31...Cquad set/ 2.5 Bullet/ 2.6 Viper/ 2.9m Reactor/ 2- 3.5m Bullet/ 3.6 Beamer/ 4m Buster/ 4m Toxic/ 4m Ikon dp/ 4.5 Bullet/ 4.9m Blade/ 5.6 Twister/ 6.6m Blade/ 7.3 Frenzy/ 7.5 Apex/ 9m Fuel/ Phantom I 9,12,15,18/ 2 Flexibugs/ PL Comp XR/ PL Big Foot/ landboards
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jeffnyc




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[*] posted on 11-18-2018 at 12:52 PM


Rage is great as an engine (moving), I didn't find it as fun static. Very stable kite. The 2.5 is close to a 3, the 3.5 is more a 4... flexifoil messes with everything with the .5 designations. Depending on your weight, maybe go for the 3.5 and fly in lower wind until you get more experience.



Foil: Speed5 18+12 | Speed3 15 | Sonic2 9m
Arc: Phantom I 12m+18m
LEI: NRG 12m, WOW 9m
FB: Flux 5m | Bullet 4.5 | Blurr 3.5 + 2.5 | Rage 2.5 | Beamer 1.8
Ride: Flexi Haize | MBS core 90 | SS Vision 140 | Mako 140 + King 165 | King Gee | SS Hover Glide | WB 5'6"
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MadHungarian


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[*] posted on 11-18-2018 at 03:08 PM


I concur with what has been said above. I have too much overlap in my quiver in the smaller sizes because I kept trying different kites and was flying only static.

I have two original version Rage 2.5m. I also have a Rage II 1.8m, which is the current version. The primary differences between the two versions are that the fabric and bridle of the old version was probably better quality and the new version has a AAA (or AoA) bridle adjustment. I utilize the AAA adjustment on the 1.8m to make it a little less grunty because now that I am buggying I use the 1.8m in high, gusty winds.

I have flown the Sting. It's a tamer kite verses the Rage. The Sting flys and turns slower and has less pull. In some ways it's like flying an air mattress. Those are desirable qualities in a beginner kite. When you start flying higher aspect ratio kites, they can be more fussy and less stable in gusty conditions. You have probably figured this out already, in the Flexifoil line going from beginner to advanced it's Sting, Rage, Blurr, Blade.

My buggy quiver is typically Rage 1.8m, HQ Toxic 3m, and Blurr 5m. (My backup or lighter wind quiver is Rage 2.5m, Blurr 3.5m, and PKD Century 6m.) The point I'm trying to make is I have a slew of other kites that don't get used, primarily due to size overlap.

So go for a 3.5m Rage if you want to stay in the Flexifoil line (or look at other 3m kites from other manufacturers, although those options seem to be diminishing). Just be mindful when flying static that you're going to have a lot more pull and will need less wind to fly safely.

You can get better deals if you can find used kites on this forum or elsewhere.
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Mark_ja_drury




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[*] posted on 11-19-2018 at 12:35 PM


I like the idea of a rage 3.5, what sort of wind speed would I be able to static fly it up to? How do the Peter Lynn sizes compare to Flexifoil, are they direct comparison m2 for m2?



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MadHungarian


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[*] posted on 11-19-2018 at 09:43 PM


I personally don't have a 3.5m Rage.

It's not just the size (power kites are sized by area in square meters) but also the aspect ratio, cell count, and bridling that will influence the kites flying characteristics and aggressiveness. The other factor is pilot skill, strength, and weight. So it's difficult to give a definitive answer to your question.

The Rage is a step up from the Sting.

It might be helpful if you add your location to your profile. You may find other kiters in your area and be able to try some of their kites before you buy something else.

If you are in an area that has typically high gusty winds, then the Rage 3.5m might be too much for static flying or at least enjoyable static flying.
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Mark_ja_drury




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[*] posted on 11-20-2018 at 03:05 PM


So I have just picked up my first kite buggy! Definitely caught the kite bug. The biggest kite I currently have is a 2.4 Flexifoil Sting, will that be big enough to get me going for my first few runs or will I need bigger? I am considering a Rage 3.5?



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rtz


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[*] posted on 11-20-2018 at 04:10 PM


If it's blowing solidly in the 20+mph range the 2.4 will work good. Get the 3.5 to buggy in wind less then that.



Sting 1.7 - Flow 2, 3, 4, 5 - Reactor 2.2, 2.8, 3.5, 4.4, 5.5 - Yakuza 2.2, 2.7 - JOJO 9
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Unk


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[*] posted on 11-21-2018 at 01:28 AM


The 2.4 will get you moving but you know you want more kite :evil:

Remember with smaller kites and higher winds things can go wrong a lot quicker, you may not go full OBE but a face plant will definitely be an option. A bigger kite in lower wind make learning to buggy a lot easier




1.5mtr HQ Beamer IV, 3mtr PKD Buster II, 4.9mtr Flexifoil Blade III, 5.5mtr PKD Buster I, 5.5mtr PKD Brooza II, 7mtr PKD Buster I
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jrhook


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[*] posted on 11-21-2018 at 06:00 AM


The Rage has an amazing wind range, especially if apparent wind is created by keeping the kite moving. The 3.5 can lift you up so learn the wind window. It's not a toy. Best of luck learning and have fun flying.

Ps - finally slayed the dreaded smart punctuation dragon.




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PL Hornet 2m with permission
Flexifoil Rage 3.5 & 4.7
Peak 3 12m
MBS Comp 95 & Michelin Man Padding
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Mark_ja_drury




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[*] posted on 11-21-2018 at 02:07 PM


Just as a matter of comparison, how would something like a 4m PL Hornet or HQ Beamer compare to a Rage 3.5? Would they be good beginner buggy kites or would I be better off with a 3m PL Hornet or Beamer?



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MadHungarian


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[*] posted on 11-21-2018 at 04:42 PM


I have not flown a Hornet but I've been told the Hornet and Beamer are similar. I would put the Hornet/Beamer between the Sting and the Rage.

The Beamer is slower flying than the Rage. It has a lower aspect ratio (I believe). For similar sizes, I would say the Rage has more pull or grunt. The Rage is more responsive and possibly more stable. The Rage has more cells , although not drastically. That makes the Rage maintain the airfoil shape better. The Rage has mesh on the leading edge openings of the cells. Some contend that helps in stability.

If you were an absolute newbie with no quad experience, the standard answer is get a 3m Hornet/Beamer as your first power kite. Since you already have a 2.4m Sting, I'm not sure the standard answer applies in your case especially since you've thrown the desire to buggy into the equation.

My first power kite was a 4m Beamer. It was fine for me to learn to fly static and also to learn when the winds were too high to use it safely. It rarely sees the light of day anymore.

If you're trying to choose between Hornet/Beamer and Rage, I would still recommend Rage. It will give you something less similar to the Sting.

Based upon my experience (I have a HQ Beamer and Toxic and a PL Voltage), comparing HQ and PL I would give the edge to PL in terms of build quality. Having said that, I'll probably never buy another PL kite because I was very disappointed in the flight characteristics of the Voltage. Just left me with a bias against PL. Many of my friends love other PL models and I've flown some of them. They are fine kites. But I digress...

As for learning to buggy, you really should find someone with experience in your area to teach you. Trying to learn on your own can be quite painful and dangerous. You need to be very comfortable with the kite before you add motion into it. Once you start moving with the kite you have to be cautious about not getting the kite behind you and especially going in the opposite direction of your motion. The result is likely an OBE (out of buggy experience). Wear safety gear: helmet, upper body protection like for motorcross, gloves, sturdy footwear with high ankles. Never buggy alone. Try to undersize your kite for the wind conditions.

And then there's the whole argument of whether to use kite killers or not. When I started flying static as a beginner I used killers. It made me feel more comfortable as a beginner. I don't use them at all now and I would advise against using them to learn in a buggy. It is better to dump the kite (i.e., let go of the handles) if you know you've put the kite in a bad spot and disaster is eminent. It's easier to fix and replace a kite than a human. You might initially be inclined to hang on to the handles because of your monetary investment in the kite. After your first OBE, you'll be less inclined to hang on. That's how it was for me anyway.
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[*] posted on 11-21-2018 at 05:26 PM


3m is a more versatile size no matter what you get. Paired with a 5m you can get all but the very low winds handled.

4m is sort of in between. It will leave you wishing you had a 5 one day and 3 the next.

The Beamer will leave you wanting to step up at some point. The Rage is a well behaved kite that you won't be in such a hurray to trade. I suspect the same with the Hornet but am not familiar with it.




Kites: 2.5m Profoil , Quadrifoil XL kitesurfer, NPW 5 Danger.
Flexifoil: 1.7m Sting, 4.9m Blade 3, 9m Blade 2.
Flysurfer : 19m Speed 2 SA, 7m Pulse
Peter Lynn :18m Phantom, 15m Synergy, 10m Synergy, 1200 Farc, 460 Sarc, 130 Tarc, 5m Peel, 4.2m , 6.4, 8.5 C-Quads, 3.5 LS2 single skin.

Rides: Flexi / P.L. Frankin'Buggy , Shaped + straight skiis, sand skis, Coyote blades. Core 95 ATB. RKB R2 ATB .

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jrhook


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Mood: skeptical yet hopeful...thnx Ines

[*] posted on 11-22-2018 at 06:44 AM


Some clips of the kites in question. The hornet 2.5 in my opinion, and not really having much else to go on, is one of the best fixed bridals to learn on. The window, setting a stance like a prize fighter to handle gusts and arm placement all happen forgivingly with this kite.

https://youtu.be/qwzzI8p7VE0

The Rage 3.5 is much more powerful and nimble. My updated feeling on kite killers is use them around other people, ditch them if no one else is at risk. Again, rather fix the kite over a dislocated shoulder.

https://youtu.be/hMA2He-xGgM






US83
PL Hornet 2m with permission
Flexifoil Rage 3.5 & 4.7
Peak 3 12m
MBS Comp 95 & Michelin Man Padding
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[*] posted on 5-7-2019 at 09:14 AM


I love the Flexifoil FB kites. I turned a beginner friend of mine on to the Sting. It's a great beginner kite, especially for static flying. My friend really enjoys having the 1.7 and 3.3 sizes. As for me, I have some older Bullets which are a ton of fun but not beginner friendly, my Rages (3.5, 4.7) on the other hand are beginner friendly and great for traction if you ever do go the buggy route. I also have a 5.0 Blurr and it is the best of the bunch for traction, period.
As far as quality, all around versatility, performance, and overall enjoyment, my Rages are my most favorite and loved kites in my quiver. This is including PL Hornets, Vipers, Viper S's, a Twister, and a Reactor.
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riffclown


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[*] posted on 5-7-2019 at 03:10 PM


My opinion. YMMV.
For static with a Flexifoil, It's really hard to beat the Bullet and Blurr. Both are faster through the window than the Rage. I personally prefer the Bullet but they are no longer made.

As for the Hornet / Beamer comparison. The Hornet is faster through the air than the Beamer but the CrossfireII and/or Toxic are on the faster side of that equation. If you didn't like the voltage, then I's say the Crossfire or Toxic are probably not going to be in your like column. Crossfire, Toxic and Voltage don't really shine for static perfomrance in my opinion.

Now when you get to Buggy Engines, those opinion changes. I prefer the Crossfire II upwind performance over all the other kites mentioned. Adjustable Angle of Attack from the factory and you can tune it to meet your conditions/skill set. Static the Crossfire will tend to fold tips on yu. Get it in apparent wind and it's a whole new game.




HQ Symphony 2.2.4!
Skydog SDT 2.8
HQ Crossfire II 2.0, 3.0 & 4.0
HQ Toxic 8.0
Flexifoil Blurr 3.5
Flexifoil Blade 8.5
PL Hornet 2.0

Before you ask, What kite Should I buy?
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AnnieO


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[*] posted on 5-7-2019 at 04:59 PM


I totally agree with you that the Bullets and Blurrs are much more responsive and faster through the window. My Bullets are my favorite static flying kites hands-down because they are so twitchy and powerful. I would never ever put a beginner on any of my Bullets though, and probably not my Blurr either. The Rages aren't going knock anyone out with their performance, but they are a good Jack of all trades master of none kind of kite that a beginner won't be too at risk with learning on. I think the OP would like any of the Hornet line too. I can't speak at all to the Crossfire II or Toxic as I never had an opportunity to try any of the HQ kites. Another thought is that the OP might also do well to also look for a used PL Viper S.
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