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Author: Subject: Single Skin Proto from MonJet Kiteboarding
Feyd


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[*] posted on 5-2-2016 at 05:24 AM


Semi-single skin. Or semi closed cell. Always thought it would be simple enough to add pockets for bladders but closed cells would be nice. Depending on how long they hold air.

Three cells don't offer a lot of volume. Loss would be fast. But better than nothing.




Chris Krug-Owner @ Hardwater Kiting. Authorized Dealer of Ozone, Flysurfer, HQ and GIN kites.
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Windstruck


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[*] posted on 5-2-2016 at 08:46 AM


Quote: Originally posted by Feyd  
Semi-single skin. Or semi closed cell. Always thought it would be simple enough to add pockets for bladders but closed cells would be nice. Depending on how long they hold air.

Three cells don't offer a lot of volume. Loss would be fast. But better than nothing.


Agreed Chris. Not sure what to call this kite (single skin, etc.); seems a hybrid design. I'm not jumping all over it with V-1.0. I've gotten burned on both the PL Uniq Quad 1.0 and B-K LongStar V-1.0. Time for others to step up as "first adopter" on this one! :P




Born-Kites:
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RaceStar (9.0m, 11.0m)
NasaStar-4 (2.5m, 4.0m, 5.5m, 7.0m)
NasaStar-3 (custom 3.2m)

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Feyd


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[*] posted on 5-2-2016 at 11:08 AM


Is it just me or does the bar look really long?




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Windstruck


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[*] posted on 5-2-2016 at 11:57 AM


Quote: Originally posted by Feyd  
Is it just me or does the bar look really long?


Not just you. Several times I've freeze framed the video trying to look at the bar. It does seem odd. Maybe this kite needs a lot of line action to operate in its stated low wind range. While a really long bar can be pain for packing purposes, it is a darn right nucence when seated in a buggy, particularly if you have anything mounted on the down tube that protrudes (GPS, GoPro, water bottle cage, etc).




Born-Kites:
RaceStar+ (3.0m, 5.0m, 7.0m, 14.0m)
RaceStar (9.0m, 11.0m)
NasaStar-4 (2.5m, 4.0m, 5.5m, 7.0m)
NasaStar-3 (custom 3.2m)

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Peter Lynn BigFoot+ nose & tail; midsection VTT rail & seat kit; home-brewed AQR

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Feyd


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[*] posted on 5-3-2016 at 07:14 AM


A while back I was playing around with an F-Arc that we had installed a bridle on to make it fly with a flatter profile. To get it to turn the bar needed to be big. I wonder if that's the same thing here.




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skimtwashington




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[*] posted on 5-3-2016 at 07:12 PM



Quote:

I've gotten burned on both the PL Uniq Quad 1.0 and B-K LongStar V-1.0.


I didn't remember if it was posted ...but what was wrong with the LongStars...?

Yeah....... water relaunch w/Peak? Forget it. In the best circumstances it's possible..... But for most of the time I really doubt it.

Until Monjet back their claim and outstanding feature- with an actual video of a water re-launch, no one should give a nickel for one of these if they plan to use on water.


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Windstruck


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[*] posted on 5-3-2016 at 09:47 PM


Quote: Originally posted by skimtwashington  

Quote:

I've gotten burned on both the PL Uniq Quad 1.0 and B-K LongStar V-1.0.


I didn't remember if it was posted ...but what was wrong with the LongStars...?

Yeah....... water relaunch w/Peak? Forget it. In the best circumstances it's possible..... But for most of the time I really doubt it.

Until Monjet back their claim and outstanding feature- with an actual video of a water re-launch, no one should give a nickel for one of these if they plan to use on water.




I'm sure I wrote about this at one point or another, but I was never a fan of the LongStars. I really, really wanted to like them but they just never worked for me.

First, the good part. I think they look fantastic! I love the extended wing profile; they always make me think of Batman. If Batman was into powerkiting the LS would most certainly sit front and center in his quiver.

On the negative side: the five lines were a pain in the seat meat. If you are used to and appreciate the simplicity of the three line NASA Stars then the LSs will likely feel very cumbersome and irritating to set up and put away if you are going to be detaching the lines from the kite each time you pack up.

Second, the LS bar seems to offer the worst of all worlds. You need to fly these kites hooked into a harness if you are going to use Steffen's bar. Once hooked in, 50% of the load goes through the harness hook into your body, but the other half is on your arms all the time. This is bad enough, but made worse by the near constant fussing you need to do for optimal smooth flight. This is no Park and Ride setup.

If you try and devise various schemes to get away from his 50/50 loading bar there just doesn't seem to be good setups that don't result in the kite doing an awful amount of backflying. Once a LS starts to fly backwards it is near impossible to get it going right again until the back stall has run its course across the entire wind window.

The kites just don't seem to fly as well as the NASA Stars. No way around it, they just don't seem to fly as well.

On the positive side the kite is a bonefide four line flyer (5-line really) and as such is proficient at reverse launches. Easier to get the kite off the ground upside down than some of the Stars.

Finally, it just doesn't seem to have any better upwind performance than the Stars.

So there you have it. I'm just not a fan. Wanted to be but in the end just couldn't be.




Born-Kites:
RaceStar+ (3.0m, 5.0m, 7.0m, 14.0m)
RaceStar (9.0m, 11.0m)
NasaStar-4 (2.5m, 4.0m, 5.5m, 7.0m)
NasaStar-3 (custom 3.2m)

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Peter Lynn BigFoot+ nose & tail; midsection VTT rail & seat kit; home-brewed AQR

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Windstruck


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[*] posted on 4-16-2017 at 06:34 AM


Inching ever closer....







Born-Kites:
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NasaStar-4 (2.5m, 4.0m, 5.5m, 7.0m)
NasaStar-3 (custom 3.2m)

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Peter Lynn BigFoot+ nose & tail; midsection VTT rail & seat kit; home-brewed AQR

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[*] posted on 4-16-2017 at 07:46 AM


I saw this the other day.

https://youtu.be/n3dzRPZIWCY




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Windstruck


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[*] posted on 4-16-2017 at 08:25 AM


Quote: Originally posted by eric67m  
I saw this the other day.

https://youtu.be/n3dzRPZIWCY


Same video! :moon:




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NasaStar-4 (2.5m, 4.0m, 5.5m, 7.0m)
NasaStar-3 (custom 3.2m)

Buggy:
Peter Lynn BigFoot+ nose & tail; midsection VTT rail & seat kit; home-brewed AQR

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[*] posted on 4-16-2017 at 10:43 AM


I apologize, my computer opened this thread to the first page where people are commenting about no water relaunch video. I just saw that video was posted yesterday. I did not see the second page until now...



Flying A mixed quiver of Flysurfer Peak kites.

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Windstruck


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[*] posted on 4-16-2017 at 01:16 PM


Quote: Originally posted by eric67m  
I apologize, my computer opened this thread to the first page where people are commenting about no water relaunch video. I just saw that video was posted yesterday. I did not see the second page until now...


No worries! The larger question is when on earth is this kite going to be available and will it actually fill a niche? I don't do wind powered water sports so I don't see the point for me personally, but who knows, maybe there are a bunch of folks out there just begging for a light weight water flyer for low wind days. If yes, then I would think they need to bump up the sizes quite a bit. The original prototype was 9m, not this 6m kite. I'd think you'd want to be in the 12m - 15m size zone to get enough grunt on low wind days. Once the wind is high enough to make a 6m the right choice there are plenty of good water options out there.

I noticed that the video showed a beautiful nose down position in the water. Often times when SS kites come out of the sky it is due to lack of sufficient wind. The kite may well collapse and hit the water in a wet mess, closed cells be damned. That's the way Peaks and LS2s often fall.

I'm also curious how the closed cells are inflated. Pump? If yes then why not go all the way with an LEI for all its advantages. Weight would be one major factor, thus the call for bigger sizes.

:karate:




Born-Kites:
RaceStar+ (3.0m, 5.0m, 7.0m, 14.0m)
RaceStar (9.0m, 11.0m)
NasaStar-4 (2.5m, 4.0m, 5.5m, 7.0m)
NasaStar-3 (custom 3.2m)

Buggy:
Peter Lynn BigFoot+ nose & tail; midsection VTT rail & seat kit; home-brewed AQR

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soliver




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[*] posted on 4-16-2017 at 04:26 PM


It looks like a hybrid between an LEI and a closed cell foil. I'm guessing that the 2 baffles on the front inflate a large bladder in the leading edge similar to an LEI.... just a guess from what you can see of the kite.



In real life, they call me Spencer

Flying-- HQ Symphony 2.1.4 (its old), 2.5m & 4m Born Kite NS2, 6m Flysurfer Peak 1 (a minty fresh Gift) and 12m Flysurfer Peak 2 (the gnat fart catcher).
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Feyd


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[*] posted on 4-16-2017 at 04:28 PM


The point beyond water relaunch would be added stability in wind shifts. There are 2 intakes at the leading edge for inflation. Since it's still in proto stage it will take time to see the bigger sizes. Scaling a kite is a huge project. But if you are going to make a one off, you make a small one. Easier, less sewing, less expensive and less risky. Give the poor guy some time. He's doing some pretty impressive work.
;)




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Demoknight


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[*] posted on 4-17-2017 at 12:58 PM


Yeah scaling kites is tough. Makers need to tweak the kites at each size to maintain the same flight characteristics across the range. It has to do with the myth that a bumble bee shouldn't be able to fly according to our understanding of aerodynamics. The fact is that scale changes the way airfoils react with the air. If you scale a bumble bee up to the size of a person or a car, then I doubt it would fly. The scale matters so much.



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Peter Lynn 2013 Reactor 8.6m
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Windstruck


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[*] posted on 4-17-2017 at 02:33 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Feyd  


Give the poor guy some time. He's doing some pretty impressive work.



I didn't intend to come off harsh. I'm personally thrilled he is innovating in the SS DP lane! I just went on their website and see that they are now looking to release versions of this kite in 6m and 10m sizes. That's a nice little quiver. :thumbup:




Born-Kites:
RaceStar+ (3.0m, 5.0m, 7.0m, 14.0m)
RaceStar (9.0m, 11.0m)
NasaStar-4 (2.5m, 4.0m, 5.5m, 7.0m)
NasaStar-3 (custom 3.2m)

Buggy:
Peter Lynn BigFoot+ nose & tail; midsection VTT rail & seat kit; home-brewed AQR

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Ed Cline


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[*] posted on 4-18-2017 at 12:57 PM


Line up for "Dibs on Steve's LS2's. Unless the Playa takes them first. :crazy:



Flying mostly single skins, with some orphans, the American flag, and a PL buggy. US01
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Windstruck


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[*] posted on 4-18-2017 at 02:21 PM


Quote: Originally posted by Ed Cline  
Line up for "Dibs on Steve's LS2's. Unless the Playa takes them first. :crazy:


Hey! I resemble that remark. :evil:




Born-Kites:
RaceStar+ (3.0m, 5.0m, 7.0m, 14.0m)
RaceStar (9.0m, 11.0m)
NasaStar-4 (2.5m, 4.0m, 5.5m, 7.0m)
NasaStar-3 (custom 3.2m)

Buggy:
Peter Lynn BigFoot+ nose & tail; midsection VTT rail & seat kit; home-brewed AQR

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[*] posted on 4-18-2017 at 07:08 PM


Quote: Originally posted by skimtwashington  

Quote:

I've gotten burned on both the PL Uniq Quad 1.0 and B-K LongStar V-1.0.


I didn't remember if it was posted ...but what was wrong with the LongStars...?

Yeah....... water relaunch w/Peak? Forget it. In the best circumstances it's possible..... But for most of the time I really doubt it.

Until Monjet back their claim and outstanding feature- with an actual video of a water re-launch, no one should give a nickel for one of these if they plan to use on water.




Video's aren't all that compelling. Take enough video and you can show even a NPW water re-launch.:D







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