Finally arrived. I'll start the review with shipping. Born-Kites were on a 2 week back order when I ordered them and it took DHL, customs, and USPS a little over 3 weeks to deliver. Tracking is useless until it reaches USPS. This isn't any fault of Born-Kites but just a heads up on overseas orders. I haven't flown them yet but will add to this when I do.

First impressions: Today I was able to spend a fair amount of time with both the 4 meter and the 5.5. The set up I'm using is the 3 line depower bar. Winds were not good at first. I flew them both for about an hour a piece in winds around 4-6 mph. They both flew great and as no surprise there wasn't much I could do with them besides loops and figure 8's in that wind, but I must say they are the easiest kites I've ever flown. They somehow relaunch easily even though its flown like a 2 line kite. They also turn and loop extremely well. The wind picked up to around 10 give or take. This is where it got interesting. It's absolutely the most confidence inspiring kite while hooked in and having some power in the gusts. All grunt and no surprises. I thought I would give the buggy a try even though I knew there was not enough wind for my 5.3 viper and the grass on the field was 8" tall and wet with some soft areas. To my surprise I was able to get moving and plow through the tall grass. I was also surprised I was able to keep moving in conditions I know I would have been frustrated in with my foils. The cool thing was i could operate the bar one handed and not have to work so hard. I never once stalled or crashed or had to get out of the bug to relaunch. Once it's in the air it stays there with very little input. I can easily let go of the bar and get in and out of the buggy. I tested the safety and it's awesome. Once released all you have to do is reach out and grab the bar and the kite pops back open. It's also nice that you can launch unhooked using the depower system and hook in when your ready. To sum it up, this is the best kite for what I do and my conditions that I have flown yet. I really can't imagine going back to my foils except maybe for some variety. They were worth the wait and I'm going to get more.

Flight Characteristics: Think semi-truck vs sports car. This would be a great touring kite for any type of land based traction.

Here is a link to John Holgate's review with more information and video

http://www.powerkiteforum.com/viewthread.php?tid=21568#pid20...

Wuhoo!!!! They're finally here!!!! :wee:

First flight info added.

awesome... glad you like them

Congrats bud! Did you go with their bar? I apologize. I can't remember if you told me.
Time for some pics!!

Yes, I went with their bar. They have 2 bar set ups. The pro depower bar and the 3 line depower bar. I have the 3 line dp bar. It's hard to explain them because it's so different then other bar set ups. I'll post some pics which will help. I'm glad I got it, the safety features are very nice.

OK. So the janky is broke down into two sub catagories: shifty, and gusty/lull.
Shifty is tough on any brand/ model foil kite in my experience with some flying better than others. Seems all the info I gather on the NS2 is they like sitting back deep in the window resulting in the trademark hard pull.

Have you had a chance to work the upwind much with these NS2?

How do they compair to the conventional foil that you have to build speed and apparent wind before steering upwind and holding a course?

I've only been in the buggy once with it so my experience is limited, but I was shocked to even be moving in the winds I was flying in. I definitely would not have moved more than 20' intervals with the my viper in the same size. Not only was I moving but I was able to go back and forth and give up little ground. When the wind did die enough that I stopped breifly, the kite stayed flying no problem and I got moving when the wind picked up. With my foil, that would have resulted in the kite stalling and most likely I would have had to get out and relaunch. I'm pretty confident from my brief experience that I will not have trouble staying upwind with better wind conditions. Also, from what I've read from John Holgate's former review, he doesn't have trouble with upwind ability. I'm sure, if given smooth beach wind conditions, that a mid aspect foil would probably be better upwind and be faster, but I could tell that the 5.5 I was flying is going to have plenty of speed for my liking on my fields that I fly in. I will gps the speeds the next chance I can to give an idea. What I like best is getting moving and staying moving even when the wind is challenging. I also like the smooth hard pull. When a couple of gusts came up, I went faster at a more comfortable pace and when a hard gust hit, I would slide sideways a bit and then speed up but it didn't feel like it was going to yank me from the buggy. I felt ultra comfortable being hooked in which was another goal of mine. When I'm hooked to my viper, It would accelerate rapidly and I didn't have an effective means of release. I just made sure I had plenty of room to turn downwind. I can't wait to test them out more thoroughly but so far I think they are a game changer for me. Also, Ive been told that the smaller sizes can achieve much greater speeds. Not unlike how smaller foils are faster than larger foils. That's why I got the 2.5. Hopefully I'll get a chance and wind to test it's top speed.

Dang. I need to make a trip to Indy now. Fly your NS2, then hop over to Chicagoland to try Demo's 2013 reactors lol.

I have great kites for oceanfront riding. That assortment is more than covered lol. My inland quiver is what needs a little more attention. They all fly, but some are better than others. I could simply stop and settle with my Ozone Flow quiver. Even though they are lower AR, they are very reliable in the janky. However, I am a kite addict. I like em all LMAO. I just love to fly! The NS2 is high on the radar as well as the 2013 reactors. Im downsizing the Toxics, and still just may fill in the gaps in my Rage quiver.

I just love the out of the ordinary appeal of the NS2
Decisions decisions.

Your always welcome in my neck of the woods. Errol's Beach is awesome in the winter to so you should plan a family trip to chicago and accidentally bring your buggy or use one of ours. You have to be careful when his sand freezes. There's jagged little seashells and debris that snags bridles and ripstop if your not careful. I've only been there once but it's quite an experience in negative wind chill. The surface is rock hard from being frozen but it's also bumpy with the occasional ice patch that can be frightening when your going fast.

A frozen beach? Wow! The coast is always a couple of degrees warmer here during winter than inland. I've never even imagined a frozen beach.

I think my top speed with the NS2's might be about 52kph. I think the Methods would have been between 10 to 15kph faster in the same conditions. Upwind is similar to a low aspect foil - maybe a degree or two less and you need to be powered. Another advantage in being so non-lifty is that you can put them above and behind you to slow you down in a hurry with much less chance of a nasty surprise than a foil.

Craig Hansen and a friend are doing 'Mad way Mongolia' at the moment (crossing Mongolia with kites). Craig is closely tied with Peter Lynn (I think) so I expect he can take his pick of kites.....what they're using this time is single skin kites designed by Michel Dekker - some a variant on the NPW design and others look very much like a Peak. Some good pictures on their facebook page here: Mad Way Mongolia

Wow John. Thanks for the input on the lift, and upwind factor.

Thanks for the offer Sean. I'm gonna have a hard time getting wifey to vaca in sub zero

Not wanting to hijack Sean's thread...but...

This vid probably gives a good idea of the Nasa Star 2's upwind ability. The inlet goes around a big curve and I go as far upwind as I can before I stop and stretch the legs - you can see by where the kite is as I start back that it's gone a good way upwind.





The evening before this we had a ripper run in 20knots or so - I started with the 2m octane and as the wind began to drop off a little, put the 2.5m Nasa Star 2 up not expecting to be able to go as far upwind - but with the extra power of the NS2, I managed to get quite a bit more upwind than the Octane.

I was hoping you would chime in. I probably should have just added on to your review to keep all the information in one spot.

Jason, I think you would really like these. It's almost too easy, it feels like cheating. For static flying they are nice for a relaxed session but my foils are more fun and exciting for static flying. I regard these as a supreme pulling engine for challenging wind and high rolling resistance such as grass. I also think they would be great for landboard and snowkiting as well as long as jumping is not the goal. I plan on making a snow buggy or maybe getting some skis at some point.

Here is a picture of the bar set up and it comes with a separate piece that attaches to the spreader bar to attach the 3rd depower line to.

Mmmmmmm. Snow sled. Makes me wish I still had my PL buggy. Been looking hard at these NS2 I tell ya.

Have you tried the Z bridle and a set of handles yet?

Ns3 is suppose to be out sometime this fall. I'm not sure how it will be different yet.

Every couple of days I load up their website to see if the NS3 is out. If it's the same price as the NS2s then I'll probably buy one right away.
I'm hoping something in the 8-10m range will be what it takes to actually get me moving in my Summer winds.

Rofer, do you fly right off handles or did you add some extensions? I don't have enough experience with them to know what would work for you yet.

I've got ~10m lines on it, but I still need some degree of cooperation from the wind which has been hard to find. Last time I went out the air was pretty still except for gusts that came from directions I couldn't predict.
I think a lot of my problem is even my best places are surrounded by trees. I doubt anything will let me fly most summer days, but I think something a bit bigger would definitely expand my options some.

It seems that most fly the ns2 off of a bar. I know that you can fly the npw9 with handles and any length line set or you can attach the kite directly to the handles and fly them.

Susan (npw goddess)

I've heard the NS2 flies fine on handles too, but they seem to be pushing using it with a bar for some reason. If I get one I definitely don't plan on spending the money on the bar to go with it.

The bar is not necessary, but I like being able to use a bar for a couple reasons. I can sit facing forward in a more comfortable position, It frees up a hand, they turn well on 2 lines (I'm assuming that's a trait of all nasa wings), it has an effective means of release, and the depower function is handy when launching (I don't anticipate on using the depower function when moving.) I think it would be fairly easy to rig any NPW on a bar using the same method that John shows in his video above (z bridle would be needed I think), but I didn't have any bar to experiment with so it was easier just to buy. I will experiment with handles eventually and I may find I like it better.

Quote: Originally posted by rofer

I've heard the NS2 flies fine on handles too, but they seem to be pushing using it with a bar for some reason. If I get one I definitely don't plan on spending the money on the bar to go with it.

It could be because their primary market includes street kiting, snow kiting and land boarding. For these markets, the bar is more popular. I like flying FB on handles, but when it comes to NS2's I'm currently using the bar - it works so well and is so simple to use. I too would like to give handles a try on the NS2's one day.

Really diggin' this thread!!!

I like to fly nasa wings as a four line kite and that has to be done with handles. It gives you more control of the kite.

Susan (npw goddess)

exactly ! if you have smooth constant coastal winds, a bar is fine.
in gusty inland winds you are much better off with handles - avoids that dreaded backward flying behaviour of all nasawings. (except maybe the new one from peter lynn, the skin?)

Hmm, I'm inland and I didn't notice any bad behaviors on the bar at all. The only time I noticed any backwards flying is in really light wind and only if I didn't keep it moving. I buggied with the 5.5 in 10ish winds and it worked great on the bar.

yes - on long lines it is usually ok. but on short or no lines a nasastar behaves - in my opinion - much better on handles..

I haven't got around to short lines yet. Good to know, thanks.