Power Kite Forum

Upwind

macboy - 16-1-2009 at 12:04 AM

Okay, so for me, the rule I try to follow is to finish where I started thereby assuming I've made good ground upwind. So I have to wonder, if it seems like a relatively easy task albeit one that requires constant edging and flying the kite right on the edge of powering out how on earth is is that people of all kite varieties are ending up 1/2 a mile upwind with seemingly no effort and I'm feeling accomplished just to have got back to where I started?

What's the trick to making big gains upwind?

ripsessionkites - 16-1-2009 at 02:43 AM

oversized kite on short lines, and pointing the kite out to the edge of the wind window and guiding the buggy more upwind.

honestly, going upwind isnt a speed thing, its being able to point the kite in a position where you are gaining ground than losing ground. some people park the kite low some park the kite high. find what works for you.

if you have to tack, making an upwind turn doesnt lose as much ground as a downwind turn.

come to nabx, i'll show ya :thumbup:

MG-kites - 16-1-2009 at 04:18 AM

Or ask the Dutch at the NABX,
In Holland we have small course for racing so often we need to make upwind turns.

BeamerBob - 16-1-2009 at 05:36 AM

really, if you "harden up" by edging upwind before you turn, you can finish your turn on the line you just came from. My best upwind slogs have been with a fully powered 5m or larger kite. I've made epic upwind cuts with my Blade IV, Blurr, Crossfire II. Fully powered is when the kite is getting about all the wind you can make use of. More wind and you are sliding/out of control. I've made some upwind turns but they were ugly since I didn't have enough room or wind to generate much momentum.

I would really love to have a week with the experts at NABX to take my buggying to the next level.

lunchbox - 16-1-2009 at 08:54 AM

Obviously you have to be sufficiently powered....so either enough wind or a kite big enough for the wind conditions.

....a good race kite helps ;-) but if there is enough wind, then a low aspect ratio kite like the Beamer's will have no problem as well!

...sometimes if the wind is too light, I have to start on a downward tack to start a good plan and then slowly start the tack back upwind.

...also...to me buggy's are the easiest to go upwind...my mountain board requires me to be a little more powered up!

...oh and finally, surface conditions are a big factor as well....don't need much wind on dirt, concrete, etc.

Good luck...and come join us at Nabx!

Bladerunner - 16-1-2009 at 03:05 PM

If I'm right you have been running low powered rather than fully powered ?

Too little wind for the kite size and gaining ground can be tough. You need to sine the kite to get enough power in lower winds. When under powered you want to slack off when sending the kite up and then try and gain ground as you pump it back through the zone. Your trail behind should reflect this push upwind then just cross wind pattern.

Lean against the power and point your ride upwind. A BIG help is to look at the point upwind that you want to obtain. You tend to go where you look!

Nothing a week at NABX wouldn't fix ;)

dgkid78 - 16-1-2009 at 04:59 PM

Well Since this post is up. I am wondering if when people are saying they are having a hard time getting upwind. I wonder if i understand exactly what this means. I have never had a problem getting back to where i started on a landboard. So I find it difficult sometimes to understand why people can't get upwind and always say they did the "Walk of Shame" ...This is what I do, am i doing this correctly or am i talkin about something completly different. Example. I find myself downwind from my Kite bag quite a bit. So I zig Zag all the way back. Slightly upwind everytime. :eureka: is that what everyone means when they say going upwind???? and is that what they are having problems with??? and if it is...have i never had an issue going upwind cause the Kite I learned on (Montana 2) is just good at going upwind? :dunno:

Bladerunner - 16-1-2009 at 06:32 PM

When I got my 1st runs. More like most of my 1st day on the Blade ATB I had trouble figuring out how to get down wind . :rolleyes: I was alone that day and it took a bit to figure things out. I ended up thinking to myself , "up on your toes and down on your butt".

What I was finding was that I needed to get on my toes and head down wind while the kite was heading up ( or slack lining ) and to lean back on my butt when I was stroking the kite back down through the power to get upwind. It's sort of the same but sideways on skis :puzzled:

Speed can be a bit of an enemy to upwind performance. Apparent wind changs everything !

If you are riding with the kite set and good power try the looking at a spot upwind method. Be reasonable and don't go too fast.

acampbell - 16-1-2009 at 06:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dgkid78
Example. I find myself downwind from my Kite bag quite a bit. So I zig Zag all the way back. Slightly upwind everytime. :eureka: is that what everyone means when they say going upwind???? and is that what they are having problems with??? and if it is...have i never had an issue going upwind cause the Kite I learned on (Montana 2) is just good at going upwind? :dunno:


That's exactly what is meant here. The zig-zagging is tacking, but the actual turn is usually a jibe, or down-wind turn to change direction, which keeps the kite safely in front of you. An upwind turn is also know as a "tack" but that is tricky because it puts the kite behind your back for a moment which invites trouble if you are not confident about where the kite is blind.

In light wind with a bigger kite, going up wind is easier than going downwind because you are often struggling to keep you lines tight, often done by hardening up, or turning into the wind. Besides when the wind has stopped altogether, the only walk of shame I have done is from Up-wind. In lighter wind, I find down-wind work tricky yet rewarding when you get it right.

macboy - 16-1-2009 at 08:01 PM

I remember last time out in the bug I worked the pants off the Access to get back upwind from maybe half down the 1/4 section we ride in. It took a MILLION zigs and 999,999 zags but I made it. In that case it was a matter of stroking some huge power (light winds that day - underpowered as ever BR :) while biting a bit downwind to build up speed and then running it out upwind until the next stroke much like BR said.

Last Saturday though, I SWEAR some dude on his psycho 13 made a straight upwind drive from our launch to the other side of the lake 1/2 mile away upwind. I'm sure I'm mistaken and he had to zig zag BUT his upwind gains were insane given the fact that I was working the dilly out of the V19 making seemingly little ground. Okay, okay, the dilly wasn't worked THAT hard but it was working.

Then again, there was a girl out flying what looked like maybe a 10 or 12m LEI and she was upwind a good 100 yards with apparent ease. She launched from downwind of us but before you knew it she was behind (upwind) of us. Actually this spawns a new question - I'll start a new thread on that matter.

WolfWolfee - 16-1-2009 at 08:55 PM

We really need a couple flags for the ice nice to watch the wind shifting patterns across the lake and gives an estimate of wind speed.
I spent time on the pack ice and having a visual focal point is a real plus IMHO.

Bladerunner - 16-1-2009 at 08:55 PM

OH, Straight up wind . That's a 13m Psycho thing :eekdrull:
;) ;)

I can head straight upwind for small spurts with the right power ?

Scudley - 17-1-2009 at 09:52 AM

The best way to learn to get up wind is practice. Have tacking duels with one of your buddies. There are two ways to get up wind. Slow speed on a very close reach, "pinching" or at high speed on something closer to a beam reach. The most efficient is somewhere in between. See my tip in your post about apparent wind.

Tacking Duals are where you and a buddy race up wind legs at close quarters. Sailing up against someone will let you see what tacks are the most efficient for your kite.
S

macboy - 17-1-2009 at 08:10 PM

I figure things went pretty well today though I still saw a bunch of guys hitting the upwind tack button on the Flysurfers ; )

Really though, we had good steady light to mid-light winds today and I never felt like I was being left in the dust - quite the contrary actually. I think it is a matter of more time flying and getting a feel for the kite / wind.