Power Kite Forum

Ace 12m

harddrive8 - 24-7-2008 at 06:51 PM

My Ace 12m has finally arrived. Upon getting home from work, I anxiously opened the box and pulled out the newest addition to my quiver. As with most new kites, it took forever to untangle the new lines. After nearly 30 minutes of working with the lines, I had done it. They were now ready to hook to the kite and handles (none came with the 12m).

I took the kite outside and pulled it out of the rucksack for the first time. I began to unfold it and became more shocked as the seconds passed as it just seemed like the energizer bunny. It kept going and going and going. After picking my jaw up from the ground several times, I finally had it completely unfolded. As I ran the lines out to my handles and hooked them up, Sandman pulled out a Crossfire 6.3m to see how it measured up in size. Needless to say the Crossfire was completely dwarfed by the Ace!

After getting everything setup, I thought the wind was light enough to not use kite killers (wind around 3-4 mph during the gusts). I pulled the handles and the kite was off! Not but a few seconds later, I was landing it and putting the kite killers that I thought weren't needed onto the brake lines. I never imagined the kite would have the pull that it does in such light winds. It wasn't so much that I was afraid of being overpowered, but more of the area I was in to fly. The area had several trees, power lines, and a shed. I wanted the KKs mainly just to reassure myself that if it got to much on one of the gusts, I could have a better chance of not flying it into the objects around me.

I can see now that this is going to be a fun ride in slightly higher winds. Everyone I've talked to that said this kite is like roping yourself to a truck and letting it drive off isn't kidding. In the light winds I played in today, it was showing it's muscle. I really don't believe this kite will have much of a gentle side unless it's on the ground... This is by far the strongest kite I've ever flown, and believe I've found the big dog for my quiver. You fellers that fly the 14m+ kites can have them. They're not for me!:o

DAKITEZ - 24-7-2008 at 07:18 PM

there's no stopping that big monster when its powered up going through the window. It is amazing how a kite can produce that much power basically on apparent wind. I would like to be there if you get it out in 8-10 mph I want to see that :o
What handles are you flying it with ? Pansh ships the 12m with handles to me and they are bigger than the handles that come with any of the other sizes. You need that extra length to get that bad boy to turn.

harddrive8 - 24-7-2008 at 08:24 PM

I'm actually using the set that came with the 4.5m Legend & 6m Ace combo. I did have a little trouble getting it to turn when flying it, but believed the reason to be to little wind.

KiteProject - 24-7-2008 at 08:46 PM

8-10 mph is a lot of wind for a 12m kite. Safety first. Factor your weight and fly accordingly but I'd say that 8-10 mph is a good enough wind for a 6.5 - 6 m kite.

Quote:
Originally posted by DAKITEZ
there's no stopping that big monster when its powered up going through the window. It is amazing how a kite can produce that much power basically on apparent wind. I would like to be there if you get it out in 8-10 mph I want to see that :o
What handles are you flying it with ? Pansh ships the 12m with handles to me and they are bigger than the handles that come with any of the other sizes. You need that extra length to get that bad boy to turn.

lunchbox - 25-7-2008 at 08:18 AM

I was also curious what kind of handles you were using and what the turning was like.

I think either Sunset-Jim or Jellis (both PKF members) had built a custom pair of handles with pulleys on them that supposedly work great with big kites. Might be worth trying out.

I also agree that 8-10mph sounds like a lot for such a big kite...be careful...I start to get a little uncomfortable in 12mph and that is with the PL Reactor 8.3 and I weigh about 216lbs.

Good luck on the flights and let us know how she flies...

DAKITEZ - 25-7-2008 at 08:34 AM

the 8-10 mph was a joke ... like let me get my video camera first before you pull it out in 10mph so we can win $10,000 from AFHV kinda joke ... seriously I wouldn't recommend it (unless I have my camera ready ;) ) till you get some time on it. 10 mph with a 12m is definately dueable. When I get another 12m in I guess we will have to get it out and see what its max range is, before it doesn't let you back on the ground. Screwy, Sthrasher, Flexiblade you guys up for it ?

harddrive8 - 25-7-2008 at 11:57 AM

I bought a pair of bigger handles from DaKitez. Hopefully it will make flying this yacht a little easier with turning and whatnot.

On a side note, I did visit a field that one of my mom's coworkers told her about. It has 6 side by side soccer fields that are pretty open and only about a 20 min. drive from my house, 5 min. from where I work. Because I was hoping to get some time in today with the 12m, I packed them in the car this morning for after I got off from work. Unfortunately, the wind didn't think it would be a good idea for me to be flying today. There are gusts of about 1-2mph every 30 min. or so, and otherwise it's completely dead outside.

After some more flight time, with the new handles, and better winds than yesterday, I'll report back and let everyone know more details.

I'm off now to double check to make SURE that my health insurance is current! :singing:

harddrive8 - 28-7-2008 at 08:12 PM

Went to the local flying field today with my new extended handles from DaKitez. The wind was blowing steady at around 5-6mph gusting to around 8-9. Put some kite killers on and went for it. The kite still pulls like a train, but at least now I can steer the thing! I got in a couple small jumps with it, the first of which was unexpected. I'm still of the opinion that I don't see how people with larger kites handle it.

Anyway, just thought I'd give an update with the kite and say I'm still very satisfied with the purchase of it. It should bring me a ton of fun in the future!

harddrive8 - 4-8-2008 at 03:28 PM

Just thought I'd comment on this kite one more time. Today Sandman and I went to Hickory to do some flying. The wind was barely going upon arrival. I pulled out the 12m expecting that to be the kite to fly because of the wind conditions. Pulled it out and flew it pretty steady for a while with just a small work out from the pull. I failed to notice the winds very gradually building up from the original 3-4mph that was blowing when we arrived.

I moved to a different area with the kite and backed myself into a sandbox as I was trying to get it started up. I managed to allow the kite to pull me back up off my backside and fought for a few minutes with the power it was generating. It gave a gentle tug as if it wanted me to jump so I gave a little leap. I managed to get about 3 feet off the ground and start my way back down, when the wind hit second gear and the kite pulled upwards again. I have had jumps prior to today that would be a jump and let the kite pull me forwards 7-8 feet and then set me down. Today was the first time I'd actually experienced a jump where a kite pulled and held me up in a vertical sense, instead of just a soft long jump. The wind had built to about 8 mph at that point so it wasn't too overpowering just kind of unexpected.

I must say that I remembered all the advice I had read on here and redirected the best I could with the kite. When I redirected, it started pulling me sideways instead of forwards, and I softly landed and rolled onto my right side. Immediately after this, I took a 5-10 min break and while the wind continued to steady increase more. I decided then that I should go ahead and pack the 12m up for the day.

I guess I'm writing this to let everyone know that the 12m Ace doesn't take much wind to get static jumps. I also wanted to thank everyone for all their advice about jumping. It was a new experience to get a vertical jump over a style where it would resemble more of a long jump. This kite has a massive load of pull but showed me today that it can still be gentle if handled correctly when you land from a jump.

WELDNGOD - 4-8-2008 at 03:35 PM

now , imagine from out of nowhere ,one of those crazy azzz gusts that can and do ,sneak up on ya'. Could be ugly.... so wear pads ,brain bucket,impact shorts are a good bet too.. have fun Bro' , but do be safe w/ that MONSTER. P.S. I want one too....

harddrive8 - 4-8-2008 at 03:43 PM

I'll probably be investing in some extra pads before too many more flights that are on the edge of getting lifted. When it kept pulling me up i thought "Let go", then I looked down and thought "NO NO NO!!" And during that split second I remembered the advice as well telling me don't let go being rule number 1. That was about the time it gusted and lifted me again. I'm glad I rode it out and landed softly. I was majorly excited about it and still am. But at the same time I realize it is possible to get hurt doing it to so I will be getting pads soon. Then I'll be ready for my next jump.

Still my biggest complaint is getting it to turn. It still takes forever to turn even with the larger handles from DaKitez. Thinking about trying to build some of the pulley handles like Jellis has and see if they help any. As soon as I figure out how to turn it better, it will be my favorite kite. Just won't receive much air time because of the size.

furbowski - 4-8-2008 at 04:11 PM

don't know if this would apply to your 12, but I improved the turn speed on my 5 by depowering and extending the tips... I'm picking up my 8m soon and will be doing the same mod on it, takes about an hour and half to do the rough mod and about the same time, maybe less, to fly and dial it in.

harddrive8 - 4-8-2008 at 05:49 PM

So just lengthen the bridle leading to the tips? Do you know about how much is required? Are there any other side effects (loss of speed, lift, etc.)?

I stopped by lowes tonight and picked up some pulleys, and some line to run through them. I've got the handles assembled in a manner that resembles jellis, but am unsure of how it will work. I finished them up about 5 min. ago and the wind is 100% dead outside right now, so it will have to wait till the wind cooperates to be tested. I'm planning on testing them first on something smaller like my Legend or 6m Ace.

furbowski - 4-8-2008 at 06:22 PM

what i did on the 5 was extend the tips by about 6-7 cm, but then I depowered the tips about five degrees by making the A row (leading edge row, the next back is the B row, then C row, some kites have a D row, my sting 1.7 has no C row, and the brakes are the X row) tip bridle a bit shorter by wrapping the line around the canopy tie twice before putting it into the larS-P-A-M-L-I-N-K-s head, this took out 1.5 to 2 cm for a total extension of about 5 cm.

I also took out the B row tip bridle completely and swapped it for the tip cascade bridle. The cascade bridle is what I call the line that is between the power bridle pigtail and the point where A B and C come together, on my 5 this line was a bit longer than the initial stock tip cascade bridle (by 6-7 cm hence a super easy tip extension). So the angle of the tip is held only by the A and C lines, which come together at the cascade bridle, which leads to the main power pigtail, which is where you larS-P-A-M-L-I-N-K-s head your power flying lines. Your kite might not have the same happy accident! And the tips seem to work fine without the B line, now in the place of the original tip cascade bridle.

I also took out the two C row bridles closest to the tip, which further depowered the tip area of the kite. It flies fine in no wind: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZhOgC992LA Note the tall poplars in the background, zero movement on the top branches.

Having 6 less lines in the tip area of the bridle also seemed to me to reduce drag and improve the low-wind performance...

Remember the first rule of kite modding: take enough pictures and notes so you can be certain of returning it to stock!!!!!

Also, this is just a suggestion, your kite might be built a bit differently.... And pansh kites seem to vary enough so that what might work on one kite might not on another...

But depowering a kite in general will improve its speed, stability, and turning speed, especially if it is overpowered in the first place. When I got my Ace I checked it out pretty thoroughly by hanging it upside down from a high ceiling and one of the biggest weird things about the kite was that the tips were powered up from most of the rest of the kite by an extra 2-3 degrees. So depowering the tips seemed to be an obvious move. I hadn't originally planned on taking out a couple of the C row on either side, but have a look for yourself: one of the C row seems useless by the way it's placed, and the other is little better. I tried taking out three, but that was too much. In the end, B row at the tip is gone, and the two C row nearest the tip are also gone.

Having said all that, I've only been flying for a year, and by no means consider myself any kind of kite guru, i just like to play around with my kites and there were tons of pansh mod resources on the web to get me going!!!! :D

Hope that all makes sense...

cheers,

furbs

dgkid78 - 4-8-2008 at 06:33 PM

Wow just checked out the price on that thing....thats amazing..I hear all the stories about Pansh bridles and handles and what not,,,,but for that price and for something i would barely use but would love to have on low low wind days i think it would last me a nice long time, maybe just going for the 8m or . especially would be great in the summer time. for 2 friggin weeks the wind has been 5-10mph and when it goes above 12mph (only time i go out for my Depower) it's raining :mad:,

_____ - 4-8-2008 at 06:35 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by WELDNGOD
now , imagine from out of nowhere ,one of those crazy azzz gusts that can and do ,sneak up on ya'. Could be ugly.... so wear pads ,brain bucket,impact shorts are a good bet too.. have fun Bro' , but do be safe w/ that MONSTER. P.S. I want one too....


The 5m wasnt enough for you was it buddy? :lol:

I really want a silver 7m though haha

harddrive8 - 4-8-2008 at 06:43 PM

furb... I understand what you have told me. I'll be sure to keep notes on anything I change and try to study the kite a little more to see what I can do with it.

dgkid78... Yes the price on any of the Pansh kites are hard to beat. They may not be the name brand of Flexi, HQ, or PL, but they do still fly nicely in my opinion. They are just a little tricky to get dialed in sometimes, which makes me believe they're not good for a starter kite. Many of the Pansh kites also produce a lot of power. Overall, if your not after name brand or worried about resale value so much, they are wonderful kites -- at least the ones I have flown are.