Power Kite Forum

Surf-Skate!!!

ssayre - 4-25-2016 at 05:54 AM

I've got something besides kites that is rare and exotic for my area on it's way. Since it's surf skate I figured it belonged here

https://vimeo.com/81230562

B-Roc - 4-25-2016 at 07:37 AM

Surf You Skate :thumbup::cool:

ssayre - 4-25-2016 at 09:44 AM

You and the others got me hooked :thumbup:

Windstruck - 4-25-2016 at 10:15 AM

So, looking past the obvious vandalism of tearing off the fence board (just a guess, but he's a renter, not the owner), what is special about this particular set up? I'm not really a skateboarder so I know I must be missing some subtle differences in the trucks and wheels, but to me this just looked like a skateboard. What makes this one special?

ssayre - 4-25-2016 at 11:06 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Windstruck  
So, looking past the obvious vandalism of tearing off the fence board (just a guess, but he's a renter, not the owner), what is special about this particular set up? I'm not really a skateboarder so I know I must be missing some subtle differences in the trucks and wheels, but to me this just looked like a skateboard. What makes this one special?


I think Carver made the video so probably no vandalism. Skate gear is similar to skiing gear to compare to something your more familiar with. Highly specialized gear for different disciplines. These trucks come as a set with wheels and all the hardware to mount to any suitable deck. The trucks are different from front to back. The front one turns more and the back not as much. They are also taller. This allows them to be highly maneuverable and highly pump-able allowing for super tight carves and to be able to build momentum without pushing with your foot. I plan on using them for exorcise, skate park, and street surf for lack of better term.

B-Roc - 4-25-2016 at 12:29 PM

To add some specificity...

The front CX truck is a reverse kingpin truck with a nearly vertical kingpin which creates a tremendous amount of lean to initiate substantial carve.

The rear CX truck is a traditional kingpin truck which is essentially "dead" compared to the front so it follows the path but not the lean of the front truck.

The net effect is that you have a very fluid setup that turns much faster than traditional RKP or TKP setups. Carvers themselves ride more like a ripstick than a skateboard or longboard. You don't have to kick at all. You can just stand on the board and pump (wiggle, smear) your feet and off you go. As a result they are more-or-less directional. Meaning it is possible to ride fakie in as much as it is possible to ride a bicycle backwards - doable but not nearly as easy as going forward.

They were designed for the sole purpose of simulating the feel of surfing on the road and they do that very well. They are unlike any other truck out there in terms for feel and drive / pump.

Carver did make that video - it is not vandalism. I no longer recall the story behind it but do recall when it was released.

lunchbox - 4-25-2016 at 12:54 PM

If you're a surfer, you'll love the C7 and CX trucks. They are the closest thing I've found to surfing on land.

And if you're not a surfer, there a great way to get around town and to stay in shape. After about 30 mins, I'm covered in sweat!

The part that I really like about skating in general is that it's so damn convenient. You don't have to worry about wind, tides, crowds, swell, etc.

Can't believe how hooked I am!

Here's a good example of a concrete wave I found recently...Just need to work up the nerve to keep going higher :o

[img]http://s224.photobucket.com/user/pmryden/media/Carver/LA%20River_zpsa6w0t1tf.jpg.html]

B-Roc - 4-25-2016 at 01:13 PM

Skating is convenient. I began in an effort to improve my foot skills for landboarding but it is the hobby that now consumes most of my time because the road and skate park are a lot more consistent than the beach as they are always open (days, nights, weekends, winters, summers, etc.)

I love skating.

ssayre - 4-25-2016 at 01:18 PM

:shocked2: :thumbup: nice spot! I've been scouting little banks but haven't found anything like that. I agree about the convenience factor of skating.

Windstruck - 4-25-2016 at 03:22 PM

Turned into a nice thread! My vandalism comment was purely for humor (at least I cracked myself up). I enjoyed reading and thinking about the trucks and the specificity of their design. I knew there was something substantial to it. I can go on like that about skis no problem! Last time I started down that road Spencer went "blah, blah, blah, skis, blah, blah". :D

PHREERIDER - 4-25-2016 at 06:39 PM

finally got that vid to play! nice trick set up for sure . could not help but notice the 420 dark choc bar in frig ...cat needs his fruit loops!


ssayre - 4-25-2016 at 09:14 PM

Quote: Originally posted by PHREERIDER  
finally got that vid to play! nice trick set up for sure . could not help but notice the 420 dark choc bar in frig ...cat needs his fruit loops!



Ha, i didn't notice that

ssayre - 4-25-2016 at 09:15 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Windstruck  
Turned into a nice thread! My vandalism comment was purely for humor (at least I cracked myself up). I enjoyed reading and thinking about the trucks and the specificity of their design. I knew there was something substantial to it. I can go on like that about skis no problem! Last time I started down that road Spencer went "blah, blah, blah, skis, blah, blah". :D


I thought you were kidding but couldn't tell for sure :)

ssayre - 4-25-2016 at 09:18 PM

Quote: Originally posted by B-Roc  
Skating is convenient. I began in an effort to improve my foot skills for landboarding but it is the hobby that now consumes most of my time because the road and skate park are a lot more consistent than the beach as they are always open (days, nights, weekends, winters, summers, etc.)

I love skating.


3 posts in a row. Pretty stoked to get these if you couldn't tell.

I'm trying these out on the shipyard first because my local shop will have to order a shaped deck with 16-17 wheelbase. I'll start out with these on my 14 3/4" wheel base. Should make for a wild and possibly slightly squirelly ride with the kite :D

Apparently all the shaped and old school decks hanging in his shop are part of his personal collection. Just goes to show it can be hard to buy a skateboard from a skater even when he owns a shop! He said all he normally sells is pop cycle sticks.

Steve, see if you can decode that lingo. :D

lunchbox - 4-26-2016 at 07:09 AM

Here's one you might like with the CX trucks - CX trucks

This is the model I want. Just can't decide between the CX and C7 trucks.

You should be getting your delivery any day now...:D




B-Roc - 4-26-2016 at 08:48 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lunchbox  


Just can't decide between the CX and C7 trucks.



You want the CX trucks. I've ridden both but own two sets of CX. They are lighter, more snappy, pump equally well and are perfect right out of the box. Neil Carver himself admits to riding CX 90% of the time because "they are that good". Unless you plan on doing a lot of grinding go CX and even if you grind (which I do) the CXs are still good if you are mindful of placement and don't get caught on the kingpin as its about 1-2mm higher than the truck.

lunchbox - 4-26-2016 at 09:25 AM

Thanks B-Roc! Yep...I think the CX trucks are the way to go especially for such a small board....I think I'll need the extra stability as well.
After riding my CX board for a while, my C7's feel kinda squirrelly at first.

Sean - You might want to change the title of this thread to SurfSkate :cool:

ssayre - 4-26-2016 at 09:29 AM

:thumbup: Good idea. Done.

ssayre - 4-29-2016 at 08:06 AM

got the carvers and took a spin around the block. These things are INSANE. Not prepared for what was to come. Beginner skaters need not apply. Just flipping nuts. More to follow on this for sure.

Lunchbox, if I tried a bank like you have pictured, I would surely die at this stage :)

PHREERIDER - 4-29-2016 at 09:24 AM

this is gonna be good, i can pheel it

lunchbox - 4-29-2016 at 09:32 AM

Cool...they arrived!

Quite different from normal trucks, huh :P

Do you like them or do you think you'll need some more time on them to get a better idea?

Oh and regarding that bank...I only mustered the nerve to go up about 4-5 feet. It's a little steeper than it looks in the pic. My goal is to get up to that crack line where that weed is growing, but that will probably take me some time. Being 49, I'm a lot more timid than I used to be.

I found a nice little bank on my way back from Streetkiting during my lunch hour yesterday that I hit after work. A lot smaller and more of a gradual slope. I like the gradual slopes a lot better at this stage as it allows me the confidence to slide out my tail at the top.

OBTW, my 10" Sidewinders should be delivered this evening so I'll put them on the Mini Lookout and have a go. If the wind is blowing (which it should), I'll try to streetkite that bank at Malibu High School that I found last week.


B-Roc - 4-29-2016 at 09:38 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lunchbox  


Oh and regarding that bank...I only mustered the nerve to go up about 4-5 feet. It's a little steeper than it looks in the pic. My goal is to get up to that crack line where that weed is growing, but that will probably take me some time. Being 49, I'm a lot more timid than I used to be.




Are you padding up? Helmet, slide gloves or wrist guards, knee and elbow? Pads add a lot more assurance and build confidence. I don't know how anyone can safely progress without them. If you had knee and wrist guards on and you fell, you could easily slide out of a bad situations on that ditch. Bum savers are a good investment too.

I ride fully padded or not at all. I've taken some wicked hits on the longboard and skateboard these past two months and no cuts or bruises to report. Pads are well worth the money if you want to push yourself to new limits.

Windstruck - 4-29-2016 at 09:54 AM

Quote: Originally posted by B-Roc  
Quote: Originally posted by lunchbox  


Oh and regarding that bank...I only mustered the nerve to go up about 4-5 feet. It's a little steeper than it looks in the pic. My goal is to get up to that crack line where that weed is growing, but that will probably take me some time. Being 49, I'm a lot more timid than I used to be.




Are you padding up? Helmet, slide gloves or wrist guards, knee and elbow? Pads add a lot more assurance and build confidence. I don't know how anyone can safely progress without them. If you had knee and wrist guards on and you fell, you could easily slide out of a bad situations on that ditch. Bum savers are a good investment too.

I ride fully padded or not at all. I've taken some wicked hits on the longboard and skateboard these past two months and no cuts or bruises to report. Pads are well worth the money if you want to push yourself to new limits.


Gotta agree there. I'm getting into kite skating and I'm getting more and more protection and feeling better and better all the time. Cerebite turned me on to this awesome upper body armor. He uses it for buggying and calls it "plastic courage". I'm using it for skating so far but could well start using it for buggying too.

Body Armor

I'm also wearing a hockey girdle of sorts with a pair of hockey shorts over them. Really protects the seat meat, hips, and thighs. Shown here is the Junior but I've got an adult size.

Hockey girdle

Top these things off with a helmet, knee and wrist guards and I'm loaded for bear! Yes, it takes a while to get dressed, and yes I feel over dressed, but I've already put these things to good use and was darn glad I had each and every bit on my body when things got busy in a hurry.

lunchbox - 4-29-2016 at 01:08 PM

@B-Roc - Yep...I always make sure to pad up and wear a helmet. So for me right now, it's helmet, knee pads and elbow pads. I have some wrist guards but never wear them...I have been thinking of wearing them however.

Truth be told, I am a little more cautious than normal even with the pads because I just got a full sleeve tattoo and don't want to risk scraping it.

@Windstruck - Holy crap....now that is what I call padded up. I don't think I would have to worry about my ink if I wore the Body Armor. It does get really hot here so comfort and mobility would be my chief concerns with something like that.
Nice to know there are options.

Windstruck - 4-29-2016 at 01:33 PM

I hear you about heat management. The upper body stuff is built off of a mesh backbone, not solid fabric so it breathes super well. The upper body armor was deigned for motocross riders who need to be very mobile, agile, and hostile, so don't worry about constricting your range of motion. The hockey girdle was designed for street hockey players and is similarly not too hot. The girdle isn't mesh though, so it is warmer.

I'm in my mid 50's and have a high travel job so I really can't afford to get injured doing my various extreme sport hobbies. Better over kill things in the "plastic courage" department than suffer unnecessary injuries and screw myself professionally.

B-Roc - 4-29-2016 at 02:48 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Windstruck  

I really can't afford to get injured doing my various extreme sport hobbies. Better over kill things in the "plastic courage" department than suffer unnecessary injuries and screw myself professionally.


Amen!

ssayre - 4-29-2016 at 09:23 PM

Here's a guy streetkiting with the carvers. He's got some other smooth streetkiting videos as well with other boards.




ssayre - 4-29-2016 at 09:27 PM

Skated various flatland spots tonight and these went from feeling bizarre and unstable to feeling very natural. I came home from skating and carved on my 15x20 patio endlessly without putting a foot down unless a fall was eminent. Crazy. It reminded me of this carver video. I'm not as good of course but same concept.




lunchbox - 5-1-2016 at 11:05 AM

Nice videos Sean! I never saw the one with the kite. Love the other one.

Here's two pics of another bank I found while I was waiting for my car to get serviced. It was raining at the time and I didn't bring my board but have skated it since. It's been fun but I wish it was about 100yds longer ;)




B-Roc - 5-1-2016 at 03:50 PM

I love the sound of wheels sliding and enjoyed the kite video. Cool bank. They don't seem to make anything like that near me outside - concrete isn't that popular out here where the temps fluctuate so much.

As you get more comfortable on the setup I'd encourage you to learn to pump switch (not fakie for this exercise). Learning to pump switch is difficult but helps the longboarding skills immensely.

PHREERIDER - 5-1-2016 at 05:10 PM

cool vids, nice patio action . endless...now thats a theme you can go with !

ssayre - 5-2-2016 at 08:44 AM

@lunchbox. That bank looks perfect. It's much harder to find one in my area than I thought. And by my area, I mean indianapolis and all the suburban areas that I work in. A good one has to exist, I just haven't looked hard enough. I will find one.

ssayre - 5-2-2016 at 08:49 AM

Quote: Originally posted by PHREERIDER  
cool vids, nice patio action . endless...now thats a theme you can go with !


Yesterday was great weather and no wind. The perfect example of why I wanted these for endless no wind fun. I must have rode the little banks on my street's driveway cuts for 2 hours and I didn't have to drive anywhere.

ssayre - 5-8-2016 at 10:47 AM

Mother in law is over for Mother's Day. I had to seek asylum in the garage for a quick session. :D


ssayre - 5-8-2016 at 11:50 AM

also had to pay a price for goofing off when I shouldn't have been. :P


ssayre - 6-15-2016 at 09:03 PM

scored a super chili on a scratch and dent sale. 28 long and 21 wheelbase. No concave only rocker. Should be a hoot to kite with.



B-Roc - 6-16-2016 at 01:19 PM

Way to go! And the quiver builds :D;)

ssayre - 6-16-2016 at 02:12 PM

Thanks! Now to figure out how to set it up. I'm almost thinking about 4.3 Bennett with wide side set wheels to have a huge contact patch. What do you think?

B-Roc - 6-16-2016 at 10:21 PM

How wide is the deck? 4.3s only have a 7" axle. If you go too narrow the board will be really divey. I'd pick the wheels out first and then get the proper axle to line those wheels up with the rail. Might want an angled riser too depending upon how much turn you want to create. Let me know what you decide.

ssayre - 6-18-2016 at 12:33 PM

That's it. My buying and testing different "streetkite" set ups is done for the most part. I've now spent fair amount of money and time trying different gear and I find it almost unfathomable that the first longboard I purchased used for $40 is the best I can find for kiting. It's not very often that you blindly stumble across something that works so good right from the beginning.

I've tried 2 different types of reverse kingpin trucks. Top mount and drop through configurations. I've tried short board and traditional kingpin. I've tried specialized surf skate carver trucks. 3 different longboard decks and one cruiser deck. None compare to my original set up witch was an s9 drop through bamboo deck with 10" gullwing sidewinder II trucks. I cracked that deck and my pivot cups on the trucks were toast so I'd been experimenting the last 6 months with different gear.

Today, I removed the brand new charger RKP trucks I had on the new Sector 9 Mini lookout and installed the sidewinder II trucks with new pivot cups. I also put the new 72mm 78a nineball wheels on it. I went out today and had perfect 4m wind. It was fantastic. Much better than any of the other set ups I've tried. Keep in mind that all the set ups work so use what you have, but the combination of sidewinder trucks and a drop through deck provides a wonderful balance between maximum turn rate and low center of gravity and wide wheel stance with the 10" trucks that just seem like it was made for kiting. The carver trucks also do a pretty darn good job but I found you have to slow way down to make transitions and take the turns wide. Even though they turn on a dime, they are very high and narrow comparatively. This causes them to slip out when initiating a transition with any speed. The funny thing about the Sidewinder II trucks is they seem to be hated by the longboard scene so I thought there must be better trucks for kiting. I think they are hated by long boarders because they aren't the greatest trucks for sliding and downhill riding. I think Gullwing unknowingly created fantastic trucks for kiting though.

That's just my opinion and kiting/skating is all about personal preference, but a drop through deck with sidewinders is a great place to start for kiting if you don't know what to get.

B-Roc - 6-18-2016 at 05:40 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ssayre  
The funny thing about the Sidewinder II trucks is they seem to be hated by the longboard scene so I thought there must be better trucks for kiting. I think they are hated by long boarders because they aren't the greatest trucks for sliding and downhill riding. I think Gullwing unknowingly created fantastic trucks for kiting though.



Sidewinder trucks have a great feel (as you know) but they are a pain if you have to swap bushings around given they use twice as many. That doesn't make them crap trucks though. If they were, they wouldn't come standard on many boards (usually pintails). They are hated for the reasons you describe. Not the most reliable to use for bombing hills and sliding at speed and since that's what many on the Fish do... well...

Glad you are finding what's best for you. It's like building a kite quiver. You need to try a lot to find the few you like.

ssayre - 6-18-2016 at 06:34 PM

Yeah b-roc and the best part is I use all of my skating stuff without kite so each trial still results in stuff I can use regularly for different disciplines.

I've been talking to lunchbox and he has been enjoying his sidewinders for kiting as well. I think we have identical set ups except the wheels.

Suds after thuds - 10-26-2017 at 09:36 AM

Going from Sidewinder IIs to C7s made me feel like I'd reached a new level all at once. Turns I never made, came easy. Bought some fresh pads before hitting the pipe tomorrow. I can't believe the difference. Now I've just got to break through and pivot from the shoulders. Sliding top turn, no more holding back, plastic courage to move past pumping up to the lip on a 5m vert. So much pucker factor before the drop becomes routine. Good things come in steps.

B-Roc - 10-26-2017 at 09:44 AM

Carver's rule in the pool/park if you prefer uni-directional skating. I like the CXs but C7s have a bit of an advantage when grinding. Pads are key to confidence. You will fall in the park. I skate way better when padded as the fear factor is diminished.