Power Kite Forum

New HQ kites??

labrat - 8-4-2011 at 08:21 PM

Looks like there are new (new to me?) kites on the HQ website. I don’t remember a discussion.

Toxic, Alpha and Beamer V

Alpha looks like a new kite. Trainer up to a 3.5m. Is there a feature to recommend this kite over starting on a Beamer like I did?

Beamer V is available in fewer sizes than the predecessor. Fine, any substantial differences between this and the IV?

Most importantly, Toxic is a replacement for the Crossfire II. Has anybody flown this kite? Even though I am not in a position to buy, I would love a review of this kite/comparison to the Crossfire II, Twister II or any other kites in this segment? Besides, with my screen name and the biohazard symbol on the bag, how could I not take notice? What can I say, I like the name.

Although I like the graphics of the Montana the best of HQ, It seems difficult to tell the Beamer V from the Toxic by the canopy. Maybe it’s the pictures I see or I’m off, thoughts? On top of that, both seem to follow the graphics of the PL Charger. Am I just too tired?

I hope to get a closer look at these kites at WW.

While I am at it, what is the R designation on the Twister II?

flyjump - 8-4-2011 at 08:24 PM

Twister 2r I think has new colors and the bridles are shorter.....I think it means revamp, but I am not sure

flyjump - 8-4-2011 at 08:38 PM

the hq rep is gonna be at wildwood next week, so you can talk to him personally if you want. they also have the matrixx which is a depower kite coming out this spring which is going to be a good looking competator to the speed 3. I saw the toxic at nabx and it was a good looking kite.

DAKITEZ - 8-4-2011 at 08:41 PM

the toxic is not in any way comparable to the crossfire or twister. It is more like the reactor 2. This year HQ does not have a lifty fixed bridle kite.

the alpha is basically a beamer 1 or 2. Hq brought it in as a price point kite.

bigkid - 8-4-2011 at 09:16 PM

The Alpha is the entry level kite, as Dino said a Beamer I or II. Still a fun kite to buggy with and take to the park to play with.
The Beamer has new graphics and is a bit more aggressive than the last model which requires a bit if brake input to fly it. It has a bit more refinement than the IV but not noticeable by the average Joe.

labrat - 8-4-2011 at 09:20 PM

By the early responses, I have to remove my comparison to the Crossfire/Twister. Sorry bout that, I got that here. http://www.extremekites.com.au/news/land-kiting/162-hq-toxic...

HQ flyer says more lift. So I have to ask, more lift than what?

Thanks

labrat - 9-4-2011 at 04:45 AM

Found the original document. Put into context, it appears that they were comparing the toxic to the beamer when speaking of lift.

acampbell - 9-4-2011 at 05:09 AM

From early accounts last year, the Toxic is in fact meant to be a lifty kite like the Twister/ Blade (nothing will ever be like he Blade). But I have not yet flown one. I think Bobby an Wexler flew proto last fall, so maybe they can chime in. Luckily, nothing will try to replace the Crossfire directly ;-).

The Beamer series has evolved itself into an intermediate kite that requires a little skill with the brakes in order to get the most out of it and also now sits at a higher price point than you average entry level, so the Alpha now fills the gap it left. Beamer I or II is a good description.

Also new is the Matrix, a high performance closed cell. While you cannot say it is a closed cell Montana, it is like the Montana in that it is higher performance over the Neo, like the Montana is over the Apex. Higher A/R, better upwind, more lift and pop, great de-power with a three-pulley mixer system in the bridle. (these are regurgitated manufacturer's comments but I hope to fly one at JIBE)

acampbell - 9-4-2011 at 05:12 AM

edit

tridude - 9-4-2011 at 05:19 AM

Id like to get a go (if possible) on the Matrix............................

labrat - 9-4-2011 at 08:03 AM

Thanks for bringing up the Matrixx - I should have included it but didn't because of previous discussion. I am watching that kite also.

Quick question about the closed cell kites. Not to derail the thread, but I have heard, and trusted, that one advantage for inland flying is the ability to "float" through or smooth out lulls. True?

BeamerBob - 9-4-2011 at 09:37 AM

I did get to fly the toxic at a kite festival in Kitty Hawk last fall. The winds were light and I think we had a 4m kite out. It has a high AR and I was told it has lift designed in but our winds didn't expose that. Craig at HQ has told me it should be a fast kite in the buggy as well. HQ will send me a few to try out once I get settled in the desert. You know a report will follow. :smilegrin:

csa_deadon - 9-4-2011 at 09:44 AM

I currently have a 2m toxic here in Oregon for a few more days (Big thanks to Chris at HQ). Hoping to get out later today and play with it.

chris - 9-4-2011 at 10:19 AM

Labrat, you can check out HQ Kites out in Wildwood. We'll have most sizes of everything with us. My fingers are crossed that a Matrixx will make the trip.

My kite of choice at NABX was the Toxic, flying the 3m, 4m, 5m and 6.5m during most of the event. I would not call it a lifty kite. Not once did it threaten to rip me out of my buggy. Comparisons to the Crossfire II or Blade are a misrepresentation. The Toxic is more of a mid-aspect performance foil (Beamer V AR: 3.6, Toxic AR: 4.5 - 4.8, Prodigy AR: 5.3 - 5.6) that proved to be stable and reliable in the fluky, desert winds. I'm looking forward to flying it more in Wildwood's gusty wash that comes from the boardwalk. Wonder if it can bust a gust like the Beamer?

some Toxic photos from NABX by Cameron Bowser...

Thinking wind ~ Chris

'Flash' in the foreground on the 4m Toxic, 6.5m in the back.


6.5m Toxic


5m Toxic


Bladerunner - 9-4-2011 at 10:39 AM

Can I get some clarification on the Beamer V .

When teaching newcomers I try to hook them up with a front line bias kite. I tell them to work on NOT including brake tension at 1st. Later when hooking them in a front line kite is also a benefit.

Do I take it that I should be suggesting the Alpha and to avoid the Beamer V for my style of teaching / learning?

Pulsar - 9-4-2011 at 02:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DAKITEZ
the toxic is not in any way comparable to the crossfire or twister. It is more like the reactor 2.

... have you flown this thing? I've used both the 4 and the 6.5, and there's LIFT in these. I was jumping the 6.5 nicely in 10 knot winds, and the 4 looked like it'd be even more fun, just needed some more wind. I'd say it has about the same amount of static lift as a Twister. That said, the Toxic has an optimised bridle while the Twister has a beginners bridle (a lot thicker), so it's actually faster then this. I would NOT use this in a buggy unless i was planning to jump it. Also, the HQ representative that was unveiling his lineup for this season on the test event, literally called it "the successor to the Crossfire II"...

Then on to the others: flown the Alpha too. It's a basic thing. Cheap fabric, knotted bridle, kind of outdated, but in return it's cheap. it's meant as a my-first-fourline-foil kind of thing. When it took of i was not impressed, it's full of wrinkles and lumps, it looked like i was flying a bridled newspaper. When i started steering back and forth though, i was surprised to see it actually handles very well. Steers nicely, has quite a smooth flow in it. Surprising, considdering its looks. No lift and little pull for its size though. Really feels like it's a trainer for learning to steer a kite on 4line handles, not much more.

Flew the Beamer V too: smoooooooth. Not much else to say about it. Same low lift characteristics, but handles like a dream. Pretty much like the last one did, only ... even better.

acampbell - 9-4-2011 at 04:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bladerunner
Can I get some clarification on the Beamer V .

When teaching newcomers I try to hook them up with a front line bias kite. I tell them to work on NOT including brake tension at 1st. Later when hooking them in a front line kite is also a benefit.

Do I take it that I should be suggesting the Alpha and to avoid the Beamer V for my style of teaching / learning?



I flew it at NABX. It is still a front-line biased kite, so you will be fine with your teaching method (which is what I use). It's just that an experienced rider will know how to get a little bit more out of it by goosing the brake tension at the right moments

ripsessionkites - 9-4-2011 at 04:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Pulsar
Quote:
Originally posted by DAKITEZ
the toxic is not in any way comparable to the crossfire or twister. It is more like the reactor 2.

a Twister. That said, the Toxic has an optimised bridle while the Twister has a beginners bridle (a lot thicker), so it's actually faster then this.


if you compare the old Twister to the new Twister II R it has a new bridle system to that of the Pro Range.

DAKITEZ - 10-4-2011 at 07:48 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Pulsar
Quote:
Originally posted by DAKITEZ
the toxic is not in any way comparable to the crossfire or twister. It is more like the reactor 2.

... have you flown this thing?


yep flew one at nabx. I did not fly it long or in the buggy, but the first thing I did when I picked it up was try to pendulum jump and I never left the ground. I think I was on the 5m. If I was on the twister or crossfire I would have left the ground for sure.

Maybe your taking the kite too high too fast in your turns? It is a medium to higher aspect kite so any of them have the potential to create lift even if they are designed not to.

ripsessionkites - 10-4-2011 at 11:31 AM

even Chris from HQ USA commented about the non-lift ... see above posts as well.

Pulsar - 10-4-2011 at 05:15 PM

Well, i agree that every medium+ AR kite with thin enough profile and bridles can be jumped, but even so. If what you're saying is true, someone at HQ Germany needs a spanking for misinforming me and the rest of the audience (closed event for kite dealers) present on a test day.

Oh and here's a quote from HQ's dealer catalog: "When you're ready to challenge gravity, the Toxic provides the speed and power to take a flying leap"... That's a horrible description if this is not a kite made for lift. :puzzled: