Power Kite Forum - Can you help a noob set up his kite? :(

Can you help a noob set up his kite? :(

kazazza - 15-2-2011 at 09:30 AM

Hi everyone, I'm new to this site and just thought I'd say hi and ask for some help!

Ive recently bought a Flexifoil Blade III (4.9m) and I'm having some trouble getting the lines set up correctly. The brake lines seem to be way too sharp - when I use them even a little bit the kite just deflates and spins... Also when its right at the top of the sky there is no chance of being able to walk backwards with it - which has made life a bit annoying!

Anyway today was my first time taking it out and I still had A LOT of fun with it - it pulled me ALL over the show lol.

How have you other Blade owners set up your lines? Thanks very much for any help you can give me! Phil. :thumbup:

kazazza - 15-2-2011 at 10:46 AM

BTW I had it setup exactly the way the instruction manual describes - could it be that the winds were too strong or that its simply because I am inexperienced? It really seemed like no matter how lightly I used the brakes, it would still fold up. Tomorrow i'll try loosening the brakes by one knot. Is that what you would do?

B-Roc - 15-2-2011 at 10:52 AM

Blades are front / power line bias kites. The brake lines can be used to add input during the turns but really only need to be tight enough to effectively kill / stall the kite when you crank back on the handles. When the kite is at the apex the rear lines should have noticeable sag in them but when you pull back on the handles the kite should begin to back to the ground.

BIII 4.9 is an aggressive kite. Be careful with it or you'll be caught out in the blink of an eye.

kazazza - 15-2-2011 at 10:58 AM

Ok, thanks, i'll try loosening the brakes next time then.

Today I just couldnt walk backwards with the kite which meant I had to keep putting it down and then getting my mate to carry it back up the field. How can I cure this?

burritobandit - 15-2-2011 at 11:02 AM

If the kite is reaching 12 o'clock above you, there should be no problem in walking backwards. What happens when you try to walk backwards?

B-Roc - 15-2-2011 at 11:03 AM

What do you mean that you couldn't walk backwards??

Couldn't because you weren't physically strong enough or ???

If that's the case you are overpowered. The only cure is less wind or a smaller kite or injury.

I just noticed in your original post you say the kite spins when the brakes are on. If that is the case at least one side is too tight for sure or your bridle is fouled

kazazza - 15-2-2011 at 11:04 AM

At 12 o'clock it was pulling me straight up too much (off the ground). I thought it would pretty much loose all power directly above me? Maybe the winds were just too strong. But when i applied the brakes even a little it just folded up and started to spin.....

B-Roc - 15-2-2011 at 11:12 AM

Blades should not be parked at the zenith. They are a lifty kite so when they are above you and powerd (as yours seems to have been) it will try to lift you as the gusts come along. If you need to rest with a blade you should either land it or fly it low to the ground and way to the side of the window.

If the kite was lifting you in a static overhead position I would say its a good thing the brakes collapsed the kite because if they were too loose you'd really have been screwed flying a very powered kite with no way to bring it to the ground (unless you had killers on and if you don't have them you should invest in them especially if learning on that kite).

Take the kite out in much less wind and then see how it peforms. As the sail comes under more and more pressure, less and less sag can develop in the brakes because the canopy flattens out.

If the kite flies fine in less wind the brakes were good you were just overpowered. If it still stalls and spins you need to let some brake out (about 2-3 inches at a time and then fine tune to your liking based on how you hold your handles).

kazazza - 15-2-2011 at 11:30 AM

Great advice thanks very much. Yes I was using kite killers, wouldn't have gone out there today without them. I'll have to see what its like in less wind and make any adjustments then. Thanks again.

tridude - 15-2-2011 at 12:04 PM

woooooohooooo the widow maker!!! B Roc is right on about the lines and good to hear your using kite killers. Zenith is the last place to leave a Blade in gusty, or smooth winds experienced pilot or not........................great kites for sure that fly well in lower winds too.......give that a shot while learning your kite and spare yourself an injury......................once you figure the 4.9 out try the III 6.6 or IV 6.5...................keep in mind many are scared away from the widow makers for good reeason......................common sense and knowing your limitations will save you on this kite..................ignore them and you'll get hurt for sure......................good luck...................... :thumbup:

:duh::duh:

awindofchange - 15-2-2011 at 01:27 PM

I created a blog post about tuning your power kite. I think it is what you need.

http://kitethoughtsfromthefield.blogspot.com/2010/01/tuning-...

If anyone is interested, I can post the blog on here.

kazazza - 15-2-2011 at 01:46 PM

That's a great guide, thanks very much. Tomorrow should be a very good day :yes:

WELDNGOD - 15-2-2011 at 02:12 PM

4.9 Blade is ALOT of kite for a noob..... This has the sound of broken bones to it... Careful w/ that kite , the learning curve for that one is painful!

kiteetik - 15-2-2011 at 02:52 PM

as an owner of more than a few blades, i've always had my brakes very nearly slack....... it depends on some things, but loose brake lines worked for me........be careful with that kite--it can get out of hand in a snap........

Bladerunner - 15-2-2011 at 04:07 PM

Sounds like you have too much kite, too much wind and too little experience.

Please listen to the folks on here. Keep flying that kite, that way in those winds and it is just a matter of time before you get hurt. Please have HUGE respect for this kite . It is the " widow Maker " for a reason !

Great kite that will take you a long way but be afraid of it ! If you aren't you should be ! Respect it and it will be amazing !

DHKITE - 15-2-2011 at 06:34 PM

listen to this man.. I walk again after several months out... I learned the hard way .

rocfighter - 15-2-2011 at 07:13 PM

Wow you have a lot of combined years here and they all seem to be giving mostly the same advice. I know a few of them and I would listen. I've never flown this kite but I have been told there tough. Be real carefull.

kiteetik - 15-2-2011 at 07:54 PM

a little fear is a good thing.

Seanny - 15-2-2011 at 08:06 PM

What you have here is a rocket. Big enough to pluck you off the ground like nothing, but small enough to drop you as if your kite turned into a plastic shopping bag. And this kite in particular has a tendency to do just that... it doesn't care. As the others have said, be very careful. As a fixed bridle foil, it is highly efficient for it's size. Meaning, it uses every square inch of material very effectively and can produce a truck load of power for a medium-small kite. These kites are not good in gusts, so be extra careful in turbulent winds, because you will take the full force of whatever rolls through. No brake line input is required to make the kite fly. They are used only for turning, and as, well, brakes. Make sure you fly with your fingertips, and keep tension on those front lines. You've got a great kite! A dangerous kite that may be difficult to learn with, but a very rewarding kite nonetheless. Good luck!

kazazza - 16-2-2011 at 05:16 PM

Thanks for all your replies guys! I took her out again today, the wind was no more than a breeze which was perfect. I loosened the brakes by one knot and it was flying perfectly. Even in such light winds I was being pulled around a fair bit, so I do respect the kite a lot, and have taken all your advice, thanks soo much for all your responses!

Seanny - 17-2-2011 at 08:14 AM

I find that having the knots spaced the same distance on the front and rear leaders, and putting both the front and rear lines on the same knot works great. E.G. the front lines are on the front line leader middle knot, rear lines on the rear line leader middle knot. You may have to adjust this to compensate for the lengths of your line... my rear lines are slightly longer than my front ones, so this set up works fine with me. Sounds like you're having fun

speleopower - 17-2-2011 at 05:15 PM

woah stop the presses! Get yourself a beginner kite and learn to fly it before you screw up the Blade or yourself in the process!
The questions you are asking are things you better know the answers to before flying a Blade. That thing is a monster.

It also sound like your holding the handles wrong. The main upper powerline should be between your index and middle finger when gripping the handles. Your ring and pinkie finger should be just dangling and not contributing much to holding onto the handles.

Please stop flying that kite until you've learned a lot more about kite control. I would hate to see a Blade get destroyed in a crash. They are quite valuable and sought after kites for good reason.

The 4.9 is my favorite kite ever please learn with a less powerful kite because I don't want the Blade destroyed in a beginner crash. Most noobs don't take the advice given on most forums so I'm really pleading for the kites behalf.

-Scott

kiteetik - 17-2-2011 at 06:02 PM

i disagree with you...... the guy first asked for advice here and most of it was sound, second,he seems amenable to the advice and gratefully thanked everyone -- you know, all noobs arent on a suicide mission....... it sounds to me like he's going to continue flying the thing in more moderate conditions,learning as he goes.......heck, a couple years ago, i bought a 9.6xxxl from you and it was one of many kites that helped me progress so rapidly....... so maybe the guy starting out with the blade aint so bad--that is as long as he has MASSIVE RESPECT for it.......

speleopower - 17-2-2011 at 06:19 PM

kazazza -How were you holding the handles? Many try to grip below the powerlines. This can cause the brake lines to seem to tight.

Most new people don't seem to take the advice given to them on various forums I'm a member of. I'm a bit skeptical now.
Hopefully this person will really take the advice like kiteetik apparently did.

pokitetrash - 17-2-2011 at 06:33 PM

Welcome to the sport Kazaaza! Wow! I dont know who sold you that kite but I sure hope they tried their best to talk you out of learning on it. Retailer or friend, someone should have tried to talk you into something else first. A great kite for later, you didnt make a bad purchase--you'll love it later for sure-- You seem determined so thats good, but back waaay down in the wind setting until you can fly that kite without looking at it so no surprises. No kidding, thats a kite that can easily make your bones move to other parts of your body and some might be on the outside...

Please please please be careful and stay in low wind....

B-Roc - 17-2-2011 at 06:44 PM

My first foil was an 8.5 Blade III. Kite skied that to 46mph the first season I owned it. Had about 10 years dual line kite flying experience before I got into power kites so I totally understood the wind window and how to read the lines and anticipate what was going to happen. The more I flew the 8.5 the more I learned to respect it. So one "can" learn on potentially dangerous kites (like a 4.9) as long as one respects it.

Not advocating that people start with lifty / aggressive kites, just saying if that's what you've found yourself with then no need to not fly it as long as you use your head and fly smart and in low winds.

As far as holding the handles with the index finger above the power leader, I think that is both a subjective preference and dependent upon how low down the handle the top leader is located. On my flexi and ozone handles I fly with the index finger above the leader but on my HQ and Windjammers and Elliots I don't, and in fact you can't really as the padding stops below the leader and the top section is extended making the grip very comfortable without the irritation of a leader running through your fingers.

If it were up to me all handles would be designed with the longer tops and the leaders placed above the finger. If you're hooked in it really doesn't matter at all and I usually fly the brakes in those scenarios. The only time I move my hands above the leader (if they aren't designed to be held that way) is if I'm overpowered and need to release some of the pressure from the bottom lines off my wrists. Its easier to hold more power with those arms up, bottom of the handles loose and power leader through your index finger but its not necessary if you fly on the brakes a lot (and I do) or if you're just not comfortable in that position.

Just one man's opinion and worth exactly what you paid for it. :rolleyes:

Bladerunner - 17-2-2011 at 07:40 PM

It is the 4.9 Blade that is the widow maker due to it's lift, power and small canopy.
In many ways I see how the 8.5 would be a good kite in a low wind learning situation. I have handed my 9m over to beginers .

I hope to think S-P-A-M-L-I-N-K- has gotten the message. He posted how he took it out in reasonable winds for learning and had a great time. Now He has hopefully felt the power and heard the stories of injury and gained the respect that this kite demands. What doesn't kill us ?

Side note : I only got better at flying once I started to move my hands down the handles. One finger above works for beginers but not for racers !

Very good point brought up...... Who the heck sold you this kite ?

kiteetik - 18-2-2011 at 05:51 AM

i feel that whoever sold this man the blade wasn't looking out for his best interests........however, since he has it now, might as well keep it and try to learn, albeit safely and carefully.......

WELDNGOD - 18-2-2011 at 06:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bladerunner
Who the heck sold you this kite ?

I was wondering the same thing.

Seanny - 18-2-2011 at 08:19 AM

Perhaps he bought it used online somewhere without consulting the shop owner? I'm not sure. Those kites are a bit hard to come across. But anyways, I think he got the message. You only live once, so don't end it early. And then again, don't live in a bubble. No need to FEAR this kite... just respect it. I think one good scare will go a long way.

When you master the Blade, you'll be leaps and bounds ahead of where you'd be if you started on a 2.5 Hydra or something...

You'll get the hang of it. You're doing fine.

Feyd - 18-2-2011 at 05:10 PM

Wait, we only live once?

What the hell is up with that?!

Seanny - 18-2-2011 at 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Feyd
Wait, we only live once?

What the hell is up with that?!

I'd hate to break it to him about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy...

B-Roc - 18-2-2011 at 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Seanny

Quote:

Originally posted by Feyd
Wait, we only live once?

What the hell is up with that?!

I'd hate to break it to him about Santa Claus and the Tooth Fairy...

My plan is to live forever.

So far... so good :wee:

Seanny - 19-2-2011 at 08:16 AM

Isn't that on Carl's Peter Lynn profile? :lol:

Sorry, we're waaaaay off topic here.

B-Roc - 19-2-2011 at 11:07 AM

Its on someone's signature on the kitecrowd site, but I can't recall whose.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled programming...

kazazza - 21-2-2011 at 09:53 AM

Ive just thoroughly read each of your posts, and thanks very much for all your concern! I bought the kite on ebay - so I never had the opportunity to actually talk face to face with any experienced fliers of this kite. I have read countless tutorials and watched many youtube videos on how to fly this kite, so I'm almost 100% sure I'm doing everything right. Apart from one thing, a few of you have said only to use my finger tips or my first 3 fingers when flying... Why is this?

I've taken it out about 5 times all together now, all in light winds, and can say I love it! Ive perfected the lines as well, they work just as I want them to. Unfortunately the winds here always seem to be very light, we only seem to get very windy days every now and again. Plus with it being this time of year, its always rainy/cold. Typical English weather! Anyway, I'm still going to go out a few more times in the light wind for the time being - can't wait till it picks up a bit though!

Thanks again for all your comments - they are much appreciated! Happy flying! Phil.

TRP - 21-2-2011 at 10:31 AM

Hey Phil,

From what I've gathered, the three finger flying method is used to help you avoid from adding brakes inadvertently.

Ted

Seanny - 21-2-2011 at 04:30 PM

Three finger flying:

Aside from the fact that yes, it ensure that pressure is ONLY being added to the front lines, it just makes you more relaxed.

Don't develop a death grip on the handles. When you need to brake, just bring in your palm and squeeze gently and ease the top end of the handle forward. If you get into trouble, it's easier for you to let go when flying with your fingertips also. It just adds a bit more control when holding the handles like this. Hope that helps!

Bladerunner - 21-2-2011 at 05:55 PM

Please be ready to say , another day when the winds do get strong ! If there are whitecaps on the water it is time to re-think the situation.
You are one of us and we all want to push the limits . The 4.9 is very skitz ! It will seem like it will behave in very strong winds without any problem then BAM before you know it. SPEED is the enemy ( or your best friend ) . The kites sees a gust as increased speed.

Speed equals power. Learn to control the speed in all conditions as you progress into stronger winds. You can control the speed either by placement in the window or by brake action.

I have been told to live every day as though it is my last and that one day I will be right !