After reading Wolfwolfee's story about the devil I'm hoping someone can help shed some light on the whole jumping/gliding thing. Let me start by
saying I'm not much of a jumper for sure. I only ride water when it's frozen and if I jump high and make a mistake the consequences are not great. So
I'm looking for some tips if anyone has 'em.
I can jump but anything about 12 feet or so and I don't know what to do with the kite. I come in with speed, throw the wing over my downwind
shoulder, redirect, pull the bar and up.
I have no clue what to do next. 10' or less and I usually come down soft but the kite clearly wants to go higher.
What do I do once I've pulled the bar in and left the ice? Do I bring the kite across the wind over head? That's waht I started doing yesterday and
it "seemed" to work well but I'm not sure it's right.
If I were as high as Wolfwolfee I would have been smoked for sure.carltb - 21-12-2009 at 01:38 PM
nice collection of chargers there mate!!!
travel from right to left - swing kite over zenith until slightly behind you - pull in bar - reach top of jump - let bar out - redirect to left and
land. (in a nutshell) just keep practising!!flyjump - 21-12-2009 at 02:54 PM
Redirect that sucker! Carltb is the master listen to himFeyd - 21-12-2009 at 03:46 PM
Yup, redirecting. But WHICH WAY? I've been redirecting across the wind in the direction I was heading prior to leaving the ice. Is That correct?
And do I hold it or sine it overhead?
Thanks for the input by the way.f0rgiv3n - 21-12-2009 at 03:54 PM
What about the dudes that float down the mtn snowkiting? They're way in the air? Do they just keep redirecting back and forth above them?lives2fly - 21-12-2009 at 05:10 PM
can tell you what to do with a landboard. I assume its the same on snow. roughly. should be easier to take off as you have more edge.
So you get your weight behind the board and edge as hard as you can for max tension in the lines? bend your knees and load up for the jump and then
(riding right to left) swing your kite back towards 12 o'clock in the window?
sheet in and pop your board to take off.
Ok you got that bit down so what I do now is keep sheeted in and keep the kite above me till i start to descend, then pull down with your front hand
to direct the kite back the way you were going as you head for the ground. Sheet out and point the board down-wind so as you land you roll towards the
kite and use up any unwanted power, then lean on your edge and power up again.
cant really explain when to drop the kite from 12 as it depends how fast you are coming down. you will get it quick enough thoughpower - 21-12-2009 at 05:57 PM
To go up, direct the kite the opposite way you're travelling. This will lift you. Once you're up direct it back towards the way you were travelling,
and then settle it above your head and that is where you will get the most float. Direct it from maybe 2 o'clock to 10 o'clock, or vise versa
depending on which way you're travelling. If you direct it to 4 or 8 o'clock you won't experience any float just an imense amount of sideways pull
depending on the winds. There are other ways to do this but this is one simple way. Just remember its always safest to keep the kite straight overhead
if you get lofted.macboy - 21-12-2009 at 06:20 PM
If I recall correctly from last winter (can't wait to go out there and keep working on it) you can get lifted by the kite but if you give yourself
even a little hop you'll gain a few inches (or feet) on your loft. Just letting the kite pull you up can work but nothing like just a little bit of a
hop.Houston AirHead - 21-12-2009 at 07:17 PM
grab your hook knife and cut all your lines
:roll:f0rgiv3n - 22-12-2009 at 08:11 AM
From what I'm gathering from Feyd's question he's more interested in how to handle floating way up there. Where to keep the kite and what to do with
the kite while you're 20+ feet in the air. I have the same question cuz i'm going to be doing some hardcore snowkiting this year and want to decend
down some good sized "hills" so I guess i'll just try and keep it going from 11 to 1 and from 1 to 11 until i'm getting close to the ground.Feyd - 22-12-2009 at 09:28 AM
Yup, that's my question for sure. How to handle the float when I'm way up. I can handle jumps in the 6- 10/12' range but the 18' and up I get kinda
freaked. I've been higher some times on purpose sometimes accidently but I've always lucked out somehow and landed without injury.
I'd like to land with some confidence and get comfortable with extended hangtime.
These new Chargers are ridiculously lifty. Scared the hell out of myself the other day test flying the 15m in hardly any wind. They out jump every
twinskin I've ever owned and I really need to make good use of the airtime I know these kites can provide.flyboy15 - 22-12-2009 at 11:49 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by f0rgiv3n
What about the dudes that float down the mtn snowkiting? They're way in the air? Do they just keep redirecting back and forth above them?
For the guys floating down the mountain, you don't usualy have to redirect. In fact if you watch the videos you will see them start down the mountain
just keeping the kite above them and the bar pulled. This actually increases your airspeed and you "fly" down the mountain at a nice clip. You will
end up reaching a terminal velocity down the hill. (10-40mph)
When they get towards the bottom, they start doing some S turns with the kite to use the energy going left and right and slow their airspeed. I can
tell you that pilots do that on final approach to drop speed or altitude or both before landing
Then right before they touchdown, they loop the kite back toward the mountain and that trades their downhill speed for stationary lift and they use
that for a nice set down.
My opinion, and what i do when i get lofted pretty good (the S-turn part)flyboy15 - 22-12-2009 at 12:00 PM
Feyd, sorry didnt answer your question
When you get lofted really good, the object is to keep the kite above ur head at all times. Because of your weight under the kite, it doesnt care
where the wind window is, its gunna fly where ever it points because it can use your bodyweight's potential energy and trade it for kinetic. The
reason i say this is because on small jumps if you get scared you can just park the kite at zenith and you will come down safe. However on big jumps
if you just fly the kite to zenith, its gunna go clear over your head in a hurry. There fore.......
....you should keep turning the kite back and forth above your head between the 1 and 11 o clock if you can, minimizing the time outside of that.
Like carl said way above, hes got the right technique. When you begin a jump (moving to your right) the kite is starting to travel from the 2 o clock
position to the 11 o clock. As its passing through 1 and 12 you start pulling the bar. It seems you have the launch down.
The secret is as the kite is going past that 1, 12 and then getting to 11, begin a full turn back toward 1 and 2 o clock (this is the redirect). For
most jumps under 20' you shouldn't need more than 1 maybe 2 redirects.
When the kite gets back to about 1 o clock you should be touching down. Tweak your turn speed and number of redirects to get that timing right.
To put it simpler, the kite starts on your right for a rightward jump. It goes from that right position, to vertical, to just past vertical (and is
now turning around), again to vertical and ends back on your right when you land.
For a left jump the kite starts on your left, moves to vertical, goes past vertical while turning around, vertical again, and ends off on the left
where it started as you touch down.
The higher the jump, the more short S turns you needpower - 22-12-2009 at 06:58 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by carltb
nice collection of chargers there mate!!!
He sure does have a nice collection, but the real question is, how's his bank account doing?:singing:PHREERIDER - 22-12-2009 at 09:36 PM
Feyd when you go up, the kite is loaded after popping you up, right, as you stated . the forward speed you have will give you the most indication
of height you can achieve. also the harder and depth you send the kite BACKWARDS into the window for the jump. a short quick pop with the kite will
produce a short quick jump and will require equal redirect speed and timing .
a fast riding, hard, full window crossing send is gonna produce MORE everything. a huge fast snatch and as soon as you FEEL the apex of the jump(
the beginning of the floaty part) this is the quick decision time moment!
-to float out and land forward in the current direction GIVE front direction after letting out, then pull in to control descent ( the bar
feedback in PL's is like magic). REMEMBER THE SPEED PART! it is still present! and now look for a landing AT speed if all is keep smooth (eyes
back to horizon as soon landing is eminent ) if the rig slows too much at the apex (like holding in too long or off timed redirect you can drop too
vertical quickly)
- or at the apex (floaty part) you want to change direction , you give back hand direction. this is where the speed control going into the jump
matters. with alot of speed its gonna be a lot of swing out ( sometimes unwanted if not timed well ) so speed control is the moderator for a cool
well controlled pause at the apex UNDER the kite then back hand redirect to the NEW direction. sometimes can be more of a drop as the speed slow.
gotta practice slower, lower well controlled, balanced under the kite transition airs.
wow what a stack of fresh units... hope this helpsFeyd - 23-12-2009 at 01:57 PM
Sir, I think you just answered my question.
The third part especially.
Now, where's the damn wind so I can try it out.
Woof!crabnebula - 26-12-2009 at 02:26 PM
Hi Feyd....
It seems that you may have found the answer but to help out....
Thinking and knowing that the kites extension, by lines, is about 20-27m by length. There is a moment that when you give the bar input or a pull, it
has a delay determined by the lines and their length as well as their stretch and the bar and line relationship (responce and bar pressure). This
delay could be called telegraphing.
Telegraphing the kite to move where you will eventually want to go is very criticle for high loftly jumps and getting into clean pain free landings...
A couple tips....for gliding (off a hill) you are NOT jumping so get more GROUND speed and less kite movement...eg bring the kite to 12 slowly as the
hill drops and you are at the speed that you are comfortable with. Think that kites like paragliders have individual glide and sink rates which will
determine how far and fast you go out from the take off as well as how high you stay from the take off.
In simple jumps, the kite moves MUCH faster as the pressure in the kite does not come from ground speed but from edging against the kite. The POP is
when you release the pressure from your edge as well as send the kite simultaneously to 12....then bringing it back down when you feel that your
height has been maxed out.
a nice tip I learned from Chasta....dont OVER SEND the kite BEYOND 12....no matter how hard or badly you want to get high the wind and the kite can
onyl do so much and oversending the kite will most often result in you falling from the sky while the kite is no longer in accordence to your center
of pressure and from the center of gravity.
In high...I mean really high jumps from flat..as in over 50 feet....getting high may be fast due to the wind and lifting parcells of air but coming
down....although can happen fast it is critical that you keep the kite over head or you will drop.
So, keep the kite at 12 and turn the kite ever so gently as you sink....in the direction that you are traveling. If you are heading right...pull
right....if you are heading left pull left, but do this while checking your height from the ground, the speed at your descent as well as the "feel"
and input you get from the bar and harness (pressure from the kite).
Hope this is helpful and if you see me out in NH or ME and the ind is good I would be happy to watch you and help you out with getting your jumps
nailed!
Zebulon
So like when you fly the kite high to go up, you must fly the kite down to go down.carltb - 26-12-2009 at 03:49 PM
top notch advice there.Feyd - 26-12-2009 at 04:35 PM
I agree, good advice.
Thanks Zeb, Phree, Fly and all for the input. You all seem to be on pretty much the same page and have given me a ton of good info to work with.
Now if I can just get a chance to put the new knowledge to work. We've got unbelivable clean smooth ice which is fun for speed seesions but not good
to practice jumping.
